Straight Outta Supertest: M3 Grant

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Source: http://world-of-ru.livejournal.com/3570808.html

First of the upcoming Firefly branch vehicles for 9.5 is the M3 Grant.

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Description:

American medium tank M3 of the first series, built specifically for the export to Great Britain according to the customer’s needs. In British army, he recieved the General Grant (Grant I) designation. 1685 tanks of this type were built in total.

The statistics are for 100 percent crew.

Tier 4 MT
Hitpoints: 320
Engine: 410hp
Weight: 29,975 tons
Power-to-weight: 13,68 hp/t
Maximum speed: 39/16 km/h
Hull traverse: 42 deg/s
Terrain resistance: 0,959/1,055/2,205

Hull armor: 50,8/38,1/?

Gun: 75mm M2
Damage: 110/110/75
Penetration: 90/102/38
ROF: 17,381
Accuracy: 0,451
Aimtime: 1,73s
Depression: -9/+20
Traverse: 30 deg

Gun: 75mm M3
Damage: 110/110/75
Penetration: 92/109/38
ROF: 20,857
Accuracy: 0,393
Aimtime: 2,01s
Depression: -9/+20
Traverse: 30 deg

Gun: 6pdr Mk.III
Damage: 75/75/100
Penetration: 105/170/30
ROF: 26,071
Accuracy: 0,403
Aimtime: 2,21s
Depression: -9/+20
Traverse: 30 deg

Viewrange: 325
Radiorange: ?

Armor:

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99 thoughts on “Straight Outta Supertest: M3 Grant”

  1. FINALLY BRITISH TANKS

    omg this looks so much better than M3 lee

    6 pdr is best gun i am very looking forward to this

    • “Finally British tanks” – lol the lee sure is :P
      Another t4 pain in the a.. to grind thru…
      And what is up with all this firefly hype? Its still a crappy sherman and if im not mistaken it was built to counter the tiger and panther tanks, so it should be at t7 which would be fun… for me :)

      • Firefly hype is part national pride and part the fact that the 17pdr is a really good gun, especially at that tier.

        And the reason it won’t be a tier 7 is that the Sherman chassis simply won’t pull it’s weight there. The armour would be garbage and it has bad depression on the 17pdr gun (-5 IIRC).

        • Well my panthers armor at t7 is pretty crap not to mention on t8 and 9 so not much difference. Give it a better HP pool and let it play with the big cats. I just hate how Allied tanks that came as a response to the tiger and panther are tiered lower….

      • It wasn’t designed to “counter” Tigers and Panthers, it was designed to give shermans a chance of hurting them, the same way upgunned 76mm shermans were.

        As for the firefly hype its simply because it was the only western allied tank which did have much success in tank on tank engagements vs the Germans (though the 76mm sherman didn’t do too bad either really). When Joe Ekins killed 3 Tigers from Wittmans squadron in 12 minutes for example. Wittmans Tiger was also destroyed in those few minutes by Fireflys under Radley Walters command. Radley Walters himself was the western allies top tank ace, all 18 of his tank kills made with the Firefly. The fact that the Radley Walters and Ekins medals are in WoT should tell you they were a pretty big deal, at least at the time.

        • There is no Wittman medal in WoT so he is not so important…
          Jokes aside, Firefly and Archer were only Alied tanks with chance to hurt germans big cats, so everybody wants them. Of course it is WG task to make them not OP neither UP. And of course they will fail initially… :/

          • Hmmmm bit of a myth there or mis-information

            Side on even a Stuarts 37mm gun could pen a panther at 600m

            The first three Tiger tanks (Tunisia 1943) and the first Panther (Italy May 1944) to be knocked out by the Western allies fell to British 6pdr guns (two Tigers to towed guns with penetration’s to turret starting at 800m – the tigers were closed down and could not see the 6 pdrs, the third fell to a Churchill – 1 round pen the drivers compartment roof, 1 round damage the gun trunnion, 1 round damage the gun balancing gear). The Panther was knocked out by a Churchill with 6 pdr in Italy

            The 6 pdrs did not at the time have APDS just APC rounds – with APDS the 6 pdr could pen the Tiger frontally at 800m

            The 6 pdr was due to be the main tank armament in 1940/41 with the 17pdr already on the design stage in 1940 before the Tiger or Panther were met – losses in France meant the 2 pdr was kept in production for longer than it should have been (desperation to replace losses and build up new new units)

            The 2pdr with littlejohn adaptor could pen the Tiger 1 sides as well as the thinner Panthers (fitted to British Commonwealth Armoured Cars)

        • “It wasn’t designed to “counter” Tigers and Panthers, it was designed to give shermans a chance of hurting them”
          Forgive me, English is not my mother tongue but this sounds the same to me.
          1. the tiger came out 2. the stock sherman could not scratch it 3. the brits upgraded the sherman to fight the tiger threat – counter it.
          I Know this is a game and not a historical simulation but putting a pz4 on the same tier as the more Advanced t34 and then down-tiering the firefly cos it is not on-par with its peers is mighty stronk logic…
          p.s. “Top tank ace with 18 tank kills?” Wow i didnt Know that. Im pretty sure Croatia during ww2 had a higher-scoring tanker than that.. lol

      • omfg…at least theres no giant unusable turret(i mean, there still is, but its waaaay smaller. and sherman firefly? confirmed to be t6. itll just be like a tog with better armor, no hp, and more mobility…thisll be fun…

    • Has anyone here noticed how the”weakspot” or “tumour” has the thickest amour on the tank? It has 71mm where the hull has 51mm. So it will still be strong compared to teir 4 tanks other than tds.

      • Also only one tumor, the commander’s turret is not on the Grant so a lower overall profile.

  4. Ehh…again free exp will be spent to skip this shit

    On the other hand at least it can use 6pdr. 110 pen will do much better than 92 from 75mm M3. Not to mention RoF

    Maybe it wont be as crappy as the M3 Lee is

    • The Lee’s 75mm was one of the better tier IV gun.

      At least before they introduced a crapload of tanks and TD with 100+ pen on that very tier.

    • Better or not, i will not keeping this one anyway.

      Now waiting for LL sherman stat…. anyone want to bet WG will BS their way with installing 6pdr on LL Sherman too? Since apparently it wont get 76mm?

    • I played Wedding Cake (know to some as M3 Lee) at the beginning of my WoT “career” back when i didn’t know much about the game (e.g. “of course next gun is always better than the previous one”, dismissing entire crew when selling tank and other newbie quirks). When i discovered “stats” and started paying attention to it, i realized that i had pretty decent winrate (56,45%) in Lee even without caring for it. And i do remember i didn’t suffer playing it.

      M3 Grant will have slightly lower profile (sans machinegun turret) and 6 pounder. I’m so not free XPing past it.

      • If this tier 4 is merely a playthrough tank you most likely will put (semi) fresh crew on it. 75% crews are so much fun :)

        Anyway, i was just reacting to “free exp will be spent to skip this shit”.

    • First of all, it’s 105 vs 92, that’s 13mm pen difference. Do you actually believe this will make any difference at all ? No, you still have to aim for weakspots on KV-1 and so on. If you try to compare the DPM you’ll see the 75mm is much better, also alpha is decent for T4, so are acc and aim time.

      Clearly the best gun on this future tank is the 75mm. That being said, I won’t play this tank more than I have to grind through it.

          • It’s a distinct variant thanks to the modified turret. It’s not really a clone – I’d call certain Chinese tanks clones of their Russian counterparts, but not the Lee and Grant.

          • You should probably look up what clone means. A clone is the same as its parent, so by definition something modified can’t be a clone. There are not yet many clones in WoT, though the type 59 for example is essentially the same tank as the T-54A in RL. The M3 stuart or Sherman 1 could well be clones though, i don’t know of any differences to the US versions, unlike the Grant which was very different to the Lee (different turret, different engine, different radio, 1 less crew)

            • Actually, clones can still be later modified. Modified means changed from what it originally was.
              And for game purposes, most people will not care about the different engine, radio or crew layout. All they’ll see is a Lee with a different ‘hairstyle’ (ergo, the turret).

  6. Another M Crap 3 Crap Lee Crap.
    I wonder from which tank will it be researchable, I don’t see any vehicle that would fit for something cross-ocean. Sexton as sharing suspension with M3?

        • They named it Stuart, however the American M3 is called Stuart in WoT despite the Americans never calling it that. Sherman, Lee, Priest, Chaffee, locust, Jackson and Wolverine are also all British names the Americans never used, the Brits named the tanks since having 2 completely different tanks called M3 was confusing. Other than the hellcat so named by the manufacturer the Americans didn’t start naming their tanks till Pershing. To avoid confusion in game they will no doubt use the Stuarts nickname amongst the troops which was Honey.

    • Lend lease line will start at tier 2 with M2A3 -> M3 “Honey” Stuart -> Grant -> Sherman 1 -> Firefly then merge with td line at tier 7.

      • I actually really like the B1. I don’t know about the lee or the AMX 40 though. I skipped the amx and I have got a win rate of about 68% in the M3 lee, I just can’t really tell if I like it. Once it is fully upgraded it is really doable. The B1 is simply a beast on its tier. You it is better at side scraping than the E75 tier for tier. The rate of fire of fire and rapid aiming time are also really nice. It turns like it’s on steroids. the only thing that tank misses is some decent top speed and a bit more penetration.

    • I wouldn’t say equally. Seems to be a bit lower, has a quite nice gun, ans I have not yet checked the armour, but seems to be also a little better. Still a garbage truck, but less so than Lee.

  11. Just for the sake of masochism I might actually play this. But yay @ the 6 pdr…

    But on the other hand, 56 games and 72% winrate in the M3 Lee say hi. One of my highest winrate tanks in the game for whatever fucking reason.

    • Winrate does not mean fun. I too had suprisingly good winrate on my Lee, but playing this thing was simply annoying as hell. No high level of winrate will force me to play a tank that is not fun. Keeper tanks are fun.

      • And plans are generally sufficient. Considering that we have entire tanks based on nothing but proposals.

        • Sadly, no. I know that there were plans to locally produce M3 Grant in Australia with local made guns. Same goes for M3 Stuart (with 2-pdr).
          And other bit of info is about the original UK tank mission in USA in 1940:
          “A report by the British Purchasing Commission highlights the armament issue. British advocated the new 57 mm six-pounder gun which was not acceptable to the Americans who preffered the dual-purpose 75 mm M2 gun, modelled on French ideas.” (see “Classic Military Vehicle” magazine, January 2013, page 23, article by David Fletcher)

  14. Pingback: Info ze supertestu: M3 Grant

  15. Excuse me, but what were those “customer’s needs”, historically speaking? How did it different from USA Lee or lend-lease one? Just curious.

    It would be also good, if you posted stats against ingame Lee, to compare.

    • The British put an extra crewman in their m3 compared to the Americans. Probably to make the tea :-)

    • Well the needs mostly came from actually fighting I would think. Good old wikipedia says:

      “Though not entirely satisfied with the design, they ordered the M3 in large numbers. British experts had viewed the mock-up in 1940 and identified features which they considered flaws — the high profile, the hull mounted main gun, the lack of a radio in the turret (though the tank did have a radio down in the hull), the riveted armour plating (whose rivets tended to pop off inside the interior in a deadly ricochet when the tank was hit by a non-penetrating round), the smooth track design, insufficient armour plating and lack of splash-proofing of the joints.[6] The British desired a number of modifications be made for the tank they were purchasing, including the turret being cast rather than riveted. A bustle was to be made at the back of the turret to house the Wireless Set No. 19 radio. The tank was to be given thicker armour plate than the original U.S. design, and the machine gun cupola was to be replaced with a simple hatch. With these modifications accepted the British ordered 1,250 M3s”

      “The prototype was completed in March 1941 and production models followed with the first British specification tanks produced in July. Both U.S. and British tanks had thicker armour than first planned.[7] The British design required one fewer crew member than the US version due to the radio in the turret. The U.S. eventually eliminated the full-time radio operator, assigning the task to the driver. After extensive losses in Africa and Greece the British realized that to meet their needs for tanks both the Lee and the Grant types would need to be accepted.”

  16. I was actually hopping the Grant will have 2pdr Mk-XB on the turret and not using the 75mm; one can dream.

  18. Dear lord, a Lee with an even better gun? That’s just going to be evil in the right hands….

  19. I thought the firefly branch would start at the Tier 5 crusader… any info on how the entire tree will look like?

    • Tier 2: m2
      Tier 3: honey
      Tier 4 : grant
      Tier 5 : sherman II
      Tier 5 : Archer
      Tier 6 Achillies
      Tier 6 : Firefly
      Tier 7 : Challenger/Avenger
      Tier 8 : Charioteer
      Tier 9 : Conway
      Tier 10 : Fv4005/2

    • Medium Mk1 -> M2A3 -> Stuart/Honey -> Grant -> Sherman -> Firefly -> Challenger/Avenger -> Charioteer -> Conway -> FV4002. Whether there will be tds before Challenger such as Archer or Achilles is currently unknown, they seem to change their mind about that regularly. Could be the td side starts at Alecto -> Archer -> Achilles -> Challenger/Avenger.

    • If you’re a regular FTR reader, you would’ve seen a number of relevant articles over the course of this year, so you might like to search for them. That said, I’ll summarise what we know so far.
      http://ftr.wot-news.com/2014/06/16/on-the-firefly-line/

      The Firefly line is a full tank branch spanning tiers 2 through to 10. It begins with U.S. Lend-Lease tanks from tiers 2 to 6, including light and medium tanks:
      - M2A3 Light Tank (?)
      - M3 Light Tank “Honey”
      - M3 Grant
      - Sherman I or Grizzly
      - Sherman Firefly
      The higher tier vehicles are all original U.K. tanks, starting with a medium tank and finishing with tank destroyers:
      - Challenger
      - Charioteer
      - FV4004 “Conway”
      - FV4005 Stage 2

      On a semi-related note, the as yet unmentioned Archer and Achilles TDs could be worked in to the UK tree as a side-branch from the Alecto to the Challenger, or might instead be introduced as premium tanks.

      • no it was already confirmed that archer and Achilles will come also a regular FTR would know that….

      • Who knows whether the challenger will be a td or a medium in WoT tbh. Its elite configuration will probably be that of the Avenger which was a TD. Pretty much the perfect tank to merge a medium line with a td line hehe.

  21. I skipped over the Lee, but went back to get it after I finally got to tier X. I wanted to see if I could actually survive! So far I’m at 51% winrate after 400 battles. The gun on the Wedding Cake is awesome. I look forward to the Grant and will get it for sure. I’m just a glutton for punishment. …and that is all with an Acer laptop and Burger King internet! :/

  22. I just hope that there will be a link to tier V or VI of the Firefly line and we will be able to skip that Lee thing…

      • Impossible. The Valentine already connects to two tier 5 tanks, and since WG insists on literal tree layouts there is no room for such a bridge in the tech tree.

        • don’t care how they do it as long as they do a link some where some how.
          Don’t he dam lee twice already, don’t want to do it again even if it has a better gun.

        • yes nothing comes after the valentine in tech tree.

          Churchill is on Matilda line and Bishop is on SPG line

  23. dammit agaming why does te shit tier 4 always have to lead to 2 tier 5s (unless 1 of them is a premium im not sure though) i hate the lee so much and thought i was never going to have to play it again but ive been trolled. well at least this one gets a half decent gun.