Hello everyone,
since I recieved like 5 e-mails about this matter, I decided to have a look. Basically, what happened: in recent South East Championship portal post, Wargaming wrote a list of countries, that can participate in that particular tournament, dedicated to – as the name suggests – SE Europe. The list is as such:
Hungary, Romania, Moldova, Albania, Bosnia and Herzegovina, Croatia, Kosovo, Malta, Montenegro, Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, Serbia, Slovenia, Greece, Cyprus, Bulgaria, Turkey
In the corresponding forum thread, players took issues with that particular post. For one, earlier, there was “Macedonia” listed instead of the current “Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia”. What is more interesting is that there is Kosovo listed amongst the names of the states.
Kosovo is a “country”, recognized only partially by the UN – Russia for example does not acknowledge its existence. As you can imagine, this did not please the Serbian players too much. The forum thread then got filled with WG staff, defending their decision.
Edit: removed controversial part of the post after sound advice
SS, you should’ve seen the shock when the Albanian president said Kosovo is part of Albania xD
Yea I bet…
Right on my Czech brother!
he never said that,he only said that Kosovo is a country for it self
Kosovo is not Serbia…
IMPORTANT, expert opinion.
You are incredibly ignorant here since Kosovo is historical homeland of serbians
Just avoid topics you blatantly ignore.
“Kosovo is historical homeland of serbians” – I laugh my ass off….
With this argument you can say: “Serbia is historical homeland of italians” as it was conquered by the Romans for centuries.
And I never got the hype around the battle of Kosovo – where the serbs have been hammered by albanians – and serbs are a kind of proud of it? WTF :)
I’m swiss and I’m very proud that our government was with the first to acknowledge Kosovo as an independent nation.
The serbs really have a problem with their history – and europe has not forgotten that Serbia has started the balkan wars in the 90′s and the war crimes committed by serbs haven’t been forgotten too.
So from my point of view it’s time to shut up for serbs and taking care of their own business – and Kosovo is sure not a part of it.
Kosovo is Serbia
Crimea is Russia
Lwow Polskie miasto
Serbia is Ottoman empire .
Russia is Golden horde .
Poland is Plumber empire .
Attention – don’t feed Latvian Troll potatoes.
Rly m8
SS, are you Serbian?
He is Czech
and Czechia is part of Germany
More like Germany is part of Bohemia :-). Learn history nub.
Oh yes and Bohemia is part of Holy Roman Empire :-). Learn history nub.
So they are effectively Romans – makes sense ;-)
*Romanians.
Learn to spelling!!!111oneone
Kosovo is KOSOVO
Crimea is CRIMEA
Russia is Stolen from the Czar! Return Russia to its rightfull Monarchy!
or shall i just mind my own business and keep out of politics as we ALL should in a gaming forum!! ;)
ehm, haven’t you noticed how close Putin is to the orthodox church? they have already accepted him as the new Russian Czar.
Bring back Rasputin.
Just stick Ras in front of Putin’s name!
Ra Ra RAS-Putin!
There lived a certain man in Russia long ago
He was big and strong, in his eyes a flaming glow
Most people looked at him with terror and with fear
But to Moscow chicks he was such a lovely dear
He could preach the bible like a preacher
Full of ecstasy and fire
But he also was the kind of teacher
Women would desire
RA RA RAS-PUTIN
Lover of the Russian queen
There was a cat that really was gone
RA RA RAS-PUTIN
Russia’s greatest love machine
It was a shame how he carried on
He ruled the Russian land and never mind the Czar
But the kazachok he danced really wunderbar
In all affairs of state he was the man to please
But he was real great when he had a girl to squeeze
For the queen he was no wheeler dealer
Though she’d heard the things he’d done
She believed he was a holy healer
Who would heal her son
RA RA RASPUTIN
Lover of the Russian queen
There was a cat that really was gone
RA RA RASPUTIN
Russia’s greatest love machine
It was a shame how he carried on
[Spoken:]
But when his drinking and lusting and his hunger
for power became known to more and more people,
the demands to do something about this outrageous
man became louder and louder.
Hey Hey Hey Hey Hey Hey repeat….
“This man’s just got to go!” declared his enemies
But the ladies begged “Don’t you try to do it, please”
No doubt this Rasputin had lots of hidden charms
Though he was a brute they just fell into his arms
Then one night some men of higher standing
Set a trap, they’re not to blame
“Come to visit us” they kept demanding
And he really came.
RA RA RASPUTIN
Lover of the Russian queen
They put some poison into his wine
RA RA RASPUTIN
Russia’s greatest love machine
He drank it all and he said “I feel fine”
RA RA RASPUTIN
Lover of the Russian queen
They didn’t quit, they wanted his head
RA RA RASPUTIN
Russia’s greatest love machine
And so they shot him till he was dead
[Spoken:] Oh, those Russians…
@SS, not anymore :P
you should focus on games not politics, shame on you
It has nothing to do with recognition of a country or not.
It is a competition based on geographical location, from which countries, regions call whatever you want can send selected number of teams to compete with each other.
it it siginificant if your main market is the former Soviet block, where the sympathy towards Serbs is prevailing (and strong ties with Russia too). I do not know if this decision was well think over by WG, but I am really suprised that they have made such move. You really do not make angry a large part f your playerbase for no reason, so there has to be one. I just do not see it.
Yugoslavia wasn’t part of soviet block
He did not say Yugoslavia was part, just theres sympathy.
However I’m not sure if it was decided by WG. I do understand it can bother people and was unfortunate to be displayed like that. However I dont think russian ever read an ESL competition for the SOUTH-EAST European region. and that is the main part in my opinion: south east european competition with all teams (on puprose I did not use the word country) from that geographical region.
The list is just there to clarify from where can they enter, too bad it caused that much trouble.
@wana: It’s not a large playerbase – it’s just a minority of morons as they exist everywhere and therefore also with serbs.
Hurrah for tribalism. I say every individual should be his own country. :))
Mi vana mek new kantri xD.
Maybe SS should look at the ethnic map of Kosovo and then say is it or not Serbia.
It’s almost the same saying in 1914:
Meh
Czech is Austria
Maybe cropanzer should look at ethnic map of Krajina region of croatia before ethnic cleansing and say it is part of croatia. Pot calling the kettle black. Hypocrites should be quiet.
:According to the Kosovo in Figures 2005 Survey of the Statistical Office of Kosovo,[168][169][170] Kosovo’s total population is estimated between 1.9 and 2.2 million with the following ethnic composition: Albanians 92%, Serbs 4%, Bosniaks and Gorans 2%, Turks 1%, Roma 1%. CIA World Factbook estimates the following ratio: 88% Albanians, 8% Kosovo Serbs and 4% other ethnic groups.[171]”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovo#Demographics
In one post you say Crimea is not Russia, on the other you say Kosovo is Serbia.
Isn’t there a contradiction?
“In 1989, Milošević, employing a mix of intimidation and political manoeuvring, drastically reduced Kosovo’s special autonomous status within Serbia and started cultural oppression of the ethnic Albanian population.[77] Kosovo Albanians responded with a non-violent separatist movement, employing widespread civil disobedience and creation of parallel structures in education, medical care, and taxation, with the ultimate goal of achieving the independence of Kosovo.[78]
On 2 July 1990 a majority of members of the Kosovo Assembly passed a resolution declaring the Republic of Kosova within the Yugoslav Federation; in September 1991 (after the dissolution of the Assembly by Serbia) they passed a Constitution which would have given the Republic effective sovereignty but which might have also been compatible with a Yugoslav confederation if this had existed; in September 1992 they declared the Republic a sovereign and independent state.[79]”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kosovo_War
I`m sure that the percentage of Germans was the same in Germany during WW2 , compared to other nationalities, and you know how hard and with witch actions Germans worked to get to that percentage.
Same happened on Kosovo.
edit:
Also, quoting wiki where ANYONE without ANY credibility can post is a great way of knowing things.
end of sarcasm
Wikipedia cites sources and has been proven on average to be as accurate as Encyclopaedia Britannica.
http://news.cnet.com/Study-Wikipedia-as-accurate-as-Britannica/2100-1038_3-5997332.html
Talking about credibility of Wikipedia is like showing you yourself have near-zero one.
So, if Albanians immigrated to area in 18-19th century, then lived for a century or two in relative peace and then started to be oppressed to the point of mass murders/ethnic cleansing, they have no right to be independent and call the place their own country?
Yes and that ANYONE on wikipedia did provide the sources from which their numbers come from so it is CREDIBLE!! but you didn’t even bother to check, didn’t you? this discredits your post and make you look like an idiot.
and if you try to research it yourself and find other credible numbers you will just yield similar results.
advice: ever tried thinking before posting bullshit first?
Looks like you didnt.
The text I quoted from Wikipedia had a cite note to CIA World Factbook.
Ever tried reading the text before attacking it?
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/kv.html
Under “People and Society” it says:
“Albanians 92%, other (Serb, Bosniak, Gorani, Roma, Turk, Ashkali, Egyptian) 8% (2008)”
Dude, are you really pointing to the CIA as a credible source to people disputing the political reality created by a US led war?
Ah, so basically, since CIA says that 92% of population of Kosovo are Albanians, it means that they are NOT Albanians just by the virtue that everything CIA says is a lie?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Kosovo#1948_census
I guess these two maps from 1922/1923 are wrong too:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Kosovo#mediaviewer/File:Distribution_of_Races_on_the_Balkans_in_1922_Hammond.png
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Distribution_of_Races_on_the_Balkans_in_1923.jpg
Um i agree with you about Kosovo man, and the CIA figures are almost certainly correct. Quoting the CIA at people who disagree is completely stupid however. Not even fox news would try to get away with quoting the CIA who are clearly a partial and unreliable source, the irony of your post was just so strong i had to point it out.
Because Fox News are so impartial and reliable, that they would certainly know what a partial and unreliable source is? Right?
Irony, you say?
Quoting CIA , good starting point for education.
remarkably stupid claim, since the % of Germans in Germany was even higher than 92% in 1932. No work was necessary, there were no foreigners in most European countries in the early 20th century.
Shame on you SS but saw that coming not first time you say stupid things!
There is a big difference between this two:
Germans was nazy but Kosovo is leading ship of democracy
Democracy? You mean like in Albania, a shithole country filled with mafia?
To be fair that is how every country started out with Democracy.
SS, you should stick to tank stuff, leave politics alone. I guess you are not anyhow specially involved in Kosovo so you, as almost everybody, knows nothing about their matter. Excactly as said above – depends on point of view. Czech is Austria (so Austrians can whenever come and claim Czech lands), Belgium is Netherlands, Netherlands is Spain, Spain is Morocco… where are we supposed to stop? In African geological depressions where a mankind is supposed to originate? Isn’t actually whole Europe in Africa?
STFU noob, this post is important, because it shows how WG policy is changing. Kosovo is a sensitive matter for Serbs, and as they are BFF with Russians, also for them, so, such switch is interesting, and yes, Kosovo is Serbian, always was, and always will be.
Your comparisions are beyond stupid.
It is irrelevant since referring to Kosovo as a country means absolutely nothing in terms of its sovereignty. Kosovo is a country regardless of what anyone on here says. As part of Serbia it had its own assembly etc and was a political entity. The question is whether the country of Kosovo is a constituent part of the sovereign state of Serbia (as it was before declaring independence) or is an independent sovereign state in its own right. And wargaming sure as hell made no reference to that. This whole thing is based off SS either not knowing what “country” means or deliberately trying to create a wargaming fail.
And what if I tell you that I think Kosovo is Albanian…. ;)
and now let the flamewar begin…
irony off – ffs who cares which historical land belongs to which administrative state? Kosovo is historical land the same way Burgundy, Silesia or Aragon is. And nothing changes if it belongs to Serbia, Yugoslavia, Albania or Martians. Kosovo is not Serbia, Kosovo is Kosovo, these days as a part of Serbia. Few centuries ahead it can be quite different as it was few centuries ago.
I just find funny that Serbians say that Kosovo is indivisible part of Serbia. Why the Kosovo people don’t think the same (at least poll showed so). Don’t they actually feel uneasy within Serbia?
Srebrenica, Mladic and Karasic are also sensitive matters for anyone who has to deal with Serbia.
Egbert2020 in the forum claimed Slobodan Milosevic was never convincted of any crimes. Well, neither was Adolf.
Kosovo is Argentina and white
Indeed, it’s your blog and ofc you should say and post what you want – but surely you knew many Serbs are butthurt over this topic, makes me wonder though – nice *Kappa* ? :P
Nothing to see here really. Being a country does not mean being a sovereign state, and i seriously doubt anything in the competition refers to sovereign states. Even without being recognised as a sovereign state Kosovo can be a country no problem.
The UN does recognise Kosovo as a country, it is only its status as a sovereign state that is disputed.
For example the countries that make up the UK are not sovereign states, nor are the overseas territories reamaining from the various European empires. The USSR was made up of countries. Places like Kurdistan are countries without full sovereignty as well.
A country can be pretty much anywhere that has any form of self governance and political identity. People could refer to the states of for example the Russian Federation as countries and they would not be wrong, and the various SSR that made up the USSR were most certainly countries.
A nation, country or state can be sovereign, but it is not required of any of them.
SS-I think you should close the comments section on this topic, too many idiots around here.
This, a lot of ignorant retards came here to troll. But i guess they have a right to express their ignorance.
Since everyone here don’t include history in arguments I have a question? If Kosovo as country was legally separated from Serbia, does that mean that Catalonia should as well be allowed to separate? Also, Serbs in Bosnia and Herzegovina (that actually live in entity that acts like separate country)? Also Crimea in Ukraine?
Why is it allowed for one country to be cut in pieces but not to others?
I, personally think that Kosovo is taken by barely non lethal force since Albanians forced their why in Kosovo for years. Ones bought land legally others through political pressure because in that time any kind of nationalism was brutally silenced so in the moment Albanians became majority in that land even though the same land was a cradle of country we know as Serbia. Ok, there are more of them, they want to separate, they got Western help… West approves. It’s done. The End.
In the meantime, Serbs in Bosnia and Herzegovina want absolutely the same thing! They live in entity called Republic of Srpska which legally takes 49% of B&H territory and 90% of them want separate country but are artificially forced to stay in that country and under penalty of war forced by Bosniaks/Muslims and supported by the West. Why can’t they get their own country? They don’t want war, they had enough of war.
The same thing is with Catalonia! 90% of them wants to separate and now I read that Spanish government is pressing charges against that leader of separation.
Russians make majority in Crimea. They don’t want to be a part of Ukraine. Why aren’t they let to live separated?
Answer me these questions with backed up arguments and then I might see the reason why one is allowed and other isn’t…
Here’s an advice – next time you want to retain a territory, be kind to people living there.
Regarding other separatist regions you mentioned – those who legally expressed their will (like Catalonia) should be able to secede, while those who did not popularily support succession should not be forced to secede (like Crimea).
Kosovo seemed to be happy to live in Yugoslavia for a century or so, until some serb politicians fucked it up, thus a popular drive to secede was started and since everyone has right to self-determination, Kosovo decided to become independent.
@Janis Zalitis – Be kind to people there? That’s like you take a person into your home but in time he self-invites his whole family into your home and all of the sudden he wants you out of your home because there are more of them than there are of you. Would you respond kindly to that people?
You haven’t answered about Serbs in B&H. Should they be allowed to separate? 49% of the country wants out.
read a bit of HISTORY b4 u wonder to make questions
@Ridvan Sadriu – If that’s all you can say, then you shouldn’t attend this discussion because question here is why are ones allowed to separate but others aren’t.
ill be short, in 1912 in one shity conference in paris or london i cant remember it well they decided to chop down albanian territory like this
north- montenegro
kosovo to serbia
south to greece
east to macedonia
if ur intrested to rly know it all try to make research on that conference and u see how it happen and why did it happen :)
So, basically Albania as country we know today didn’t exist before 1912? Good to know…
ur rly a dickhead srsly
who said it didnt i said on 1912 they cut part of albanian territory
how come u cant understand that much
“they decided to chop down albanian territory like this” where is the part that albania didnt exist here ?
@Ridvan Sadriu Why with the insults? I thought we were having a debate… I read the same thing you told me to read and there was a part of the Albanian independence after which Albania became the country we know today. And the Albania we know today didn’t exist before 28 November 1912. and was recognized by the world on 29 July 1913. Serbia, on the other hand existed long before that (something like 10 centuries before). We could debate who was first but none of us was present at the time and history tend to be forged by the strongest ones so I take everything anyone can say with a great dose of distrust.
Albanians arrived and were a majority a century before Milosevic.
After some time passes, you can no longer request people to leave, because it is essentially their homeland – they have been born there.
Are you trying to defend Milosevic’s genocide?
@Janis Zalitis – Genocide?? People these days use that word as if they’re saying “good morning”. I’m not defending Milosevic, far from it but a part of your comment “Albanians arrived and were a majority a century before Milosevic.” makes me think you want to accept part of history that only suits your arguments. And to answer in the same matter, Serbs had a country on that territory 10 centuries before Albanian nation even existed! How about that? And before Serbs, there were Romans and before Romans there was someone else so, if you want to follow known history, then they all should move and give a land to Italy?! Btw, as far as I’m informed, no one wanted Albanians to leave, they just refused to give them more territory so they took it by force and when all hell broke out, NATO came and bombed Belgrade. Why? Who knows…
It sounds like you are getting your kool-aid from Serbian state TV.
1. Genocide of Milosevic regime is a fact, established by International Court
2. The Albanians first appear in the historical record in Byzantine sources of the 11th century. Most historians conclude that the Albanians are descendants of populations of the prehistoric Balkans, such as the Illyrians, Dacians or Thracians. Serbs immigrated to Balkans during 5th-7th centuries, so more than two thousand years AFTER historical ancestors of Albanians.
As far as I know, Milosevic was never sentenced for any of the crimes he was charged because he died before the trial could end. Maybe he would be sentenced, maybe he wouldn’t be. We’ll never know. We may assume that he would be sentenced but then again, Seselj was held 4297 days if I’m not wrong and they are releasing him because the can’t prove anything against him. Whole that trial was a big embarrassment to judicial system as it proved to be a joke. Anything a Hague has to say in future won’t have any weight whatsoever.
As for history part, you said it your self, Albanians appeared very early, but not as Albanians but as tribes tat predated any of the people that live there. Albania as country and Albanians as nation we know today came much later (around WWI if I’m not mistaken) while Serbia was existed, stopped existing when Ottoman empire came and then existed again and all before Albania, so, legally, that land “belonged” to Serbia.
Ok, I agree that Albanians as majority took their right to separate but that right should have every nation on this planet but it doesn’t…
curious, from which Nazi party website did you copy this? NPD, FN, BNP or PVV?
I agree with all your examples and am also disguted by double standards in world politics.
I recently visited B&H cpouple times and I think everyone is waiting for the end of this failed experiment of implementing a federal-canton-entity system which noone really wants. They don’t want war, just live the way they want to.
If Catalans want their independence and show it through a referendum, then yes Catalonia should become its very own country. Just like Britany or Corsica in France should become countries if they expressed such desire. Or Crimea or East Ukraine. You can’t deny the people the right to have their own governance if they feel like the country they belong to no longer represents them. And I think you’ll find the western critics of the Crimea/Ukraine thing is not that the people there can’t decide what they want for themselves, but rather the way it was done.
But of course you’ll disagree and blabber about Serbia stronk and remove kebab so I don’t know why I even bother.
@perkele – Do you even read these comments? First part was very helpful to this discussion but a part “But of course you’ll disagree and blabber about Serbia stronk and remove kebab so I don’t know why I even bother.” makes no sense because no one here said that either Serbia or Albania are right or wrong. We’re trying to understand why is acceptable by the world for Serbia to lose a part of territory but it’s not acceptable for Spain, Ukraine, Bosnia and Herzegovina and now France. I forgot about that, thanks for mentioning it.
Is it because EU has all the military power to do whatever it wants without regard of what people want? Whoever stands against EU and the West must be crushed? After all the facts we gathered here, that’s the only logical explanation… and it’s the wrong one because no empire stands forever. Tomorrow a wind could change its direction because Eastern Sun rises over awakened bear. Tomorrow a new history could be written…
“Edit: removed controversial part of the post after sound advice”
what did I miss?
You can ask him personally in PM.
Whoever raises political problems in a video games blog makes a mistake.
Video games are politics. Political situations affect WGs business alot.
KOSOVO IS SERBIA,and always will be one way or another.If UN didnt recognize it why should WG???
The UN recognises Kosovo as a country, WG treats Kosovo like a country. The UN doesn’t recognise Kosovo as a sovereign state, WG didn’t say anything about sovereignty anywhere.
Where is the problem.
Hey SS, imagine that the Kosovo matter is a delicate thing for us Romanians as well.
We are one of the few EU/NATO countries that did NOT recognize Kosovo, mainly due to “autonomy” claims from a very vocal hungarian minority here, in order to avoid a precedent.
Just throwing this in here
Exactly, this is also one aspect. Just the way a successful Scottish independence could have start an avalanche of similar votings (Catalonia…).
Well that kinda worked the other way since Catalonia is probably more likely to force independence now that Scotland voted no because they are so annoyed at not getting to have their say whereas before they would probably have waited to see whether Scotland fail cascaded/was let in the EU etc which would have taken years.
You might be right… either way could be oil on fire. In this case, we should prepare for more of such votings, there are many similar situations in Europe.
Well… actually, the schizophrenia is there concerning both countries (Kosovo and Macedonia), since some countries recognized them, some not.
E.g. Hungary recognized Macedonia as such, so here officially it is Macedonia, WITHOUT the stupid ‘FYRO’-prefix. And afaik, many EU countries recognized Kosovo as such. Historical facts have nothing to do with todays real life reality.
WG can’t please everyone, there is no middle way, there will be ones pissed off with either choices.
(In parentheses: everyone has the right to call himself/themselves whatever they want. It is called the right to self-determination.)
My opinion: natonalism is one of the most cancerous idea ever invented. It is like cheap booze, people stop thinking and start acting like zombies.
First of all I am Albanian and as such, a bit biased.
But, IMO, Serbs and the rest of the world (that thinks otherwise) needs to accept that Kosovo as a country is a reality, no matter how much you declare “Kosovo is Serbia”.
The sooner we accept the reality the easier will be our countries’ integration to the European family. The final aim is us all to join Europe and be united for the common good (even if politics will still screw us).
I would also like to suggest to SS not to post political content. Yes, it is your blog, but whether you like it or not this is also a very public blog so you still have a lot of responsibilities.
Lets keep the fight within the game while still having fun.
A sober man… alas, too rare in these issues.
Too True!
The way you are using Serbian legitimate territory for criminal activities like drug and weapons smuggling to rest of the Europe, human organs trafficking and rest will give you huge amount of credibility.Not a day passes than someone`s house is burned down, a hand grenade gets thrown at someone just for being non-Albanian. All this without formal investigation, which is backed up by corrupted Europeran institutions on Serbian southern province.
Once European Union sees thru your agenda, you could wish for “integration”, using occupied part of another territory as basis point.
Can you deny Srebrenica while you’re here? Because your posts on the WG forum left a lot to be desired in your one-sided posting rampage.
Hi I am Serbian and I live on territory of Kosovo i Metohija and I agree with you on the matter of not posting political content its just negative popularity, people come here to argue and no good will come from it.
On the other hand please understand both sides, it serious matter and it is stirring up a lot of emotions.
Thanks
So you think that land where Kosovo is should not be on the map or be under Serbia? How can you say that when Kosovo is a country for 6 years now?
Wake up.
So, when is Putin going to ‘not’ support pro-Russian rebels that will suddenly appear in Belarus?
When pro-western rebels, supported by CIA, overthrow Lukashenko.
Clearly WG is a CIA front organisation.
The Treaty of Versailles was instrumental in the creation of the League of Nations (the fore runner to the United Nations). The nations involved signed up to the treaty on the basis of fourteen points. To afford “mutual guarantees of political independence and territorial integrity to great and small states alike”. Just supposing that they had signed up to a fifteenth point “that the League (UN) will not recognise any country as a soveign state if it does not have a population of at least 8 million people”. Just think how many wars, and lives could have been saved by that simple amendment to the treaty/charter.
Heh, this way the EU would have only cc. half as many member states as it has now… :D 10-million countries (Portugal, Sweden, Hungary, Belgium…) are considered middle-sized. :-)
Well that’s Denmark, Norway, Iceland, Luxembourg, Monaco, the Vatican, Singapore, Estonia, Lithuania and Latvia fucked then.
Daft idea, what did Iceland ever do to you ?
Czech Rep. Slovakia, Slovenia… Austria is almost borderline… Are you sure with that 8 million?
Yeah, because ww2 was down to the little countries…..
League of nations was a catastrophic disaster, it didn’t recognise the USSR and the USA didn’t join. Japan, Germnay and Italy all ignored it. Its charter was never invoked and no country was stopped from invading another because of it. Cutting out the smaller countries would just have made it even more of a lame duck.
And why would the little countries care less anyway, UN membership is meaningless unless everyone buys into it and clearly peoples of less than 8 million are not going to buy into something that completely disenfranchises them.
The wars would just end up being bigger and more widespread. If you need 8 million people to get UN recognition that would clearly be a reason for say Albania to be actively involved in the Yugoslav wars since you know it would need those ethnic Albanians from Kosovo and Bosnia to be a “real” country.
Hey, hey, hey, hey, I know how to start a shitstorm.
Wait for it….
Tibet and Taiwan!
Well.. you should wait till tomorrow since the time difference could delay the storm in this case…
FTR comment section is mostly Euros, they probably don’t give a shit about Asian affairs.
Shit on Wargaming, here’s how they created the state http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Organ_theft_in_Kosovo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crimes_in_the_Kosovo_War
Stop playing WoT.
stop being a dick!
How was Serbia Created? Who’s land did they steal?
Just stfu and DONT PLAY WOT!
Ve made Serbia on ur mother ass ,big busty ass :D
“Ve” made…..nice spelling.
Like it or not, the state of Kosovo does exist. How can Serbs say Kosovo is Serbia when you have no Serb authority inside Kosovo?
Serbs are day-dreaming and wont stop doing so.
The 78 days of Bombing did not happen for no reason. Largest US base in Europe is in Kosovo. US has made this land independent and tha’s it.
Hope WG puts Albania flag and also the Kosovo flag too.
Peace!!
De facto that state exist, it’s administered by Kosovan government and Serbs has no control under it. So which country Kosovar Albanians should represent in competition, Serbia? Albania? I think no one wants that, It’s better when they have their own representation.
I am from Dardania and I feel sad how politics have ruined my country over millenniums, and also have changed my name from Dardania to Kosova!
As a World of Tanks player, I’ve paid more than 1200 Euros so far and if WarGaming wouldn’t Recognise the people who live in the territory of Dardania (Kosova) it would be a shame and very rude.
World of Tanks is suppose to be a friendly game, accepting all nationalities, despite conflicts.
I am not going to argue here with Serbian (Russian) people, as we’ve been arguing since their arrival on the 6th Century and we haven’t solved our problems yet. Having said that, the history of human kind will always be repeated. Idiot people will always find a way to be idiot and complain or argue about something that doesn’t make sense.
As an Illyrian, and Dardanian, I know you Serbian (Russian) people have stolen 85% of my land. The bare existence of you in Balkan is entirely on Dardanian land, yet you deny my existence?
I haven’t denied your origin existence that you’re Russian and I accepted your Russian language in Balkan in 6th century as a friend, but differences arose with time and conflicts crossed our path, hence the dispute over land.
Whether you are Russian (Serbian people) living in Balkan, you should be peaceful no matter where you live. This Earth belongs to GOD, not to Nationalists.
If you ask me, I’d fight criminals of all races and Cold Idiots who kill people, and not other people who want to live in peace.
Good Day SS!
WG, much like any other for-profit company, wants max profits, not max niceness. If Russians boycott WoT over Kosovogate, WG will quickly affirm the non-existence of independent Kosovo, which would have relatively minor repercussions in comparison.
WG dont give a shit some times, they add the flag and then they remove if if the russians dont like it. WG is the best example of a hyper capitalist company even worse than companies that exisit in the west believe it or not.
I’ll try to bring a lawyer’s view on the subect
It seems that a lot of comments are biased and rely more on emotions than hard facts. This is understandable as international law is not that clear on the subject as it needs to reconcile 2 opposing rights: self determination and sovereignty.
I’ll spare you the latin jargon but in essence what is needed for self determination is at the very least: 1/ a people 2/ an existing and undisputed territory 3/ a clear willingness for independance.
In the case of Kosovo (same with Crimea) it was an autonomous province with a clearly defined territory and was existing for a long enough time. This is not the case for the Serbian republic of Bosnia as this is a very recent creation. Based on this principle I think it is very possible that Serbs from Bosnia will be able to claim their independance in 20 or 30 years.
Of course something might be “legal” but might not happen in reality because of the balance of powers. For instance Serbia was an independant country and then it was absorbed by the Ottoman Empire and ceased to exist for almost 500 years. When Serbia regained their independence they argued they had one people (or nation) the serbs, one territory (what had been conquered by the ottoman empire) and it was clear they wanted to be independent. While it was legal it only became possible when the Ottoman Empire was weak enough to allow it.
With Kosovo that’s the same thing a vast majority of the population was Albanian, the territory was clearly defined and had working institutions for a long time and the Kosovars/Albanians wanted to become independent. It also only became possible when Serbia was weak enough to allow it.
The simple possession of a territory is not a sufficient claim, so Russia saying Ukraine is the cradle of Russia, Serbia saying Kosovo is the cradle of Serbia or France saying we used to own Belgium are not enough to get rights to possess the territory.
For Catalonia there is no clear willingness to become independent (1.6m people voted for against a potential voting population of 5.4m so about 30%).
What makes the situation worse is that all countries and I mean ALL are twisting the principles all the time to match their own interests which is supported by the medias and is only adding fuel to the fire and contributes to hatred generation which is very bad.
For instance Russia refused to recognize the indepenence of Kosovo but did pretty much the same thing in Crimea. This hypocritical attitude is only too common and was used by the west many times before during the end of the colonial period.
I’m afraid all of this nationalist business is about emotions. We’re all alopecic apes, with a common ancestor ~200 000 years ago (0.0044% of Earth’s age), attached to a small speck of dust sitting in a vast cosmos, but what’s really important is what I call the fenced off plot of land I live on.
I’m a Serb from Serbia. Kosovo was a part of Serbia, but it’s currently under U.S. occupation. There is American military base in Kosovo, making it an American state. Kosovo is a part of U.S.A. and it has nothing to do with Serbia, Albania or any other shit country from Balkans…
Yeah, and you guys didn’t butcher Muslim population in ex-Yugoslavia in 90′s.
Say it, come on, don’t hold your feelings.
Don’t argue with Serbs my friend, they will never accept whatever they did!
It’s the code of their Bible to never accept what they do!
Nah, they just drink too much vodka…
They can’t even write a proper newspaper with that collective intellect.
Nope, Serbs drink rakija, not votka (vodka).
Yup everything else is 100% true, we did all those things, let me remind you that every morning, I woke up, killed some Shiptars and some Croats, then I jump to America to kill some civilians there and then I wash my teeth and eat gibanica for breakfast
Lol ideote.
Hahaha Zoran :) Prav Srbin!!!
Well,I fear this is my first and final post here,since after 15k battles and arguably a lot of fun,I ‘ll have to quit playing after WGs decision to go along and name Kosovo a country..
I suppose it is just a business for them,certainly it’s not “all about having fun”,”it’s just a game” and similar childish statements that were used to defend their decision..
So,no more gold for me,no more bucks for ya WG..Sometimes profit can be incompatible with political correctness,and even if it does not it is simply a matter of principle and ethics..
PS I am not Serb,or even east european,but unfortunately I had witnessed first hand the atrocities committed in the name of that region’s “freedom”..
Good battles for ya all..Cheers
Who cares. They’re bastards. Bastards of gaming. I mean WG…
Besides, Balkans are known for wars since late 1800′s… And things are still going pretty hot, even today.
Lol, you stop playing because they add a fucking flag in the game? Who cares your weak kid.
Don’t be dense, wargaming never said Kosovo was a country, and even if they had that is not the same as saying it is a sovereign state.
ESL made the rules, not wargaming, and nowhere is there a judgment of sovereignty made in any case.
Its not wargamings list.
Nowhere does it refer to countries.
Even if it had, being a country is not the same as being a sovereign entity, Kosovo was a country even when it was part of Serbia. There are hundreds of countries in the world which are not independent or sovereign.
I live in my own country, which is my home. I like to film porn ther, ihih xD.
http://s18.postimg.org/9dtepz1qx/nas_i_rusa.jpg take nad translate this! :)
and more http://youtu.be/6ZDLQk0nPGo :D
Kosova is own country okey. Now stfu.
I was there 15-16 years ago as part of the NATO forces, they will always kill each other because they have yet to develop far from the old Feudal way of thinking from the 18th century. And that goes for ALL of them but especially the Serbs…..brutish and thuggish people, no class with very few exceptions.
My GOD!!!!!!
Look how Serbs want to put the whole world to sleep and think that Kosovo is Serbia. Just look at all the Serbs trying to manipulate the entire world in thinking Kosovo is Serbia.
Serbs, get over it. Wake up and live your life without Kosovo just like you don’t have Slovenia, Croatia, Bosnia, Montenegro or Macedonia. Try to keep Vojvodina as it can get very tight. Thy can leave you too.
I do not like Serbs or Russians because they are killing their own Slavic people. Serbs and Russians in one way or another are like cancer to the Slavic people. It’s a fact you can’t ignore.
Hasta la vista Serbia.
What a retard
Hum no.
Your really fucking stupid aren’t you? Kosovo is SERBIA, HISTORICALLY AND ALWAYS WILL BE
WG went against Mother Russia’s word?? Putin is gonna be pissed, we’ll probably see SerB in gulag soon.
It’s amazing how such little things create a big shitstorm. GJ people, especially the butcher Serbs.
Fuck it
*slow clap*
Really love all those “Entire nationality is trash” statements. Maybe Europe is due for another Denazification, eh?
Try going there with a gun and try to stop the fucktards killing each other…..then come back to me and tell me why they are all wonderful, the whole area is still in the Middle Ages but with Guns…and has been like that since the Middle Ages.
Member States of the United Nations
http://www.un.org/en/members/index.shtml
CANT FIND KOSOVO ?!? Where the fuck is it in the list?
Who cares what anyone else or WG is saying? Enjoy the game…lol
Srbi se naložili na to jer su ih braća Rusi po drugi put izignorirali u mjesec dana. LOL
Never give a single Dinar to WG!
Well, initially I was sympathizing WG for the haircut they received at BOC.
Now I dont.
WG bots apologized and changed their announcement. lol, lol and lol.
http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/447249-south-east-europe-championship/
http://worldoftanks.eu/en/news/pc-browser/esport/south-east-europe-championship/
Now it is Former Yugoslavia. Somehow you have to keep the Serbs down. Now WG has said to the Serbs yes, SANTA does exist and you will get you presents.
Serbia is removed as well.
See how evil and ugly Serbs are?
They want to drag the whole world in the darkness just like they are living it.
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One would think after Mladic and Karasic the Serbs would pipe down on the whole subject. This is like Germany making demands for Danzig…