Team Battles with tier 9 and 10 tanks? Permaban.

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Source: RU forums (thanks to Fan_of_Bulba for the link)

Hello everyone,

just some quick heads up. Today, a bug was detected in the 7/42 code, allowing under certain conditions to use tier 9 and 10 tanks in team battles. I assume the same bug probably appeared on EU and US server too, since the patch was the same. The bug will be hotfixed, but according to the Russian developer, accounts abusing this bug will be permabanned (a few Russians already were actually, a list of who was publicly displayed for once). So… just don’t do it.

Edit: On 31.12.2013, patch 8.10.2 will come out, apparently fixing this thing. Here is a screenie of one of the Russians, that got permabanned.

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And such is the fate of the cheater (it says “blocked permanently”):

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63 thoughts on “Team Battles with tier 9 and 10 tanks? Permaban.”

  2. Seems legit apart from the actual parts of the license the dev quoted.
    I just don’t see what there is to decompile in this case =)

    • If you cheat it poker is it your fault or the dealers’/games’?
      It’s perfectly normal to ban exploiting/cheating in this way. Besides, the rules actually state that using exploits to profit in the game – is a bannable offense, so it’s not like they aren’t warned.

    • If a car has bad locks and you break in easily, it doesn’t make you any less a thief. Even an idiot would figure out that if he takes tier 9 tank in tier 8 max battles, it’s some kind of exploit. Plus, the exploit is not that easy to do (IIRC), the perps knew what they were doing,.

      • Is there a way to add editing posts or deleting them? I know that this isn’t a forum and edrard will probably have to do it in any manual way, just asking. I try not to have any typos, but that’s hard sometimes and at other times you just need to delete a posting with random shit etc.

        • It’s available, IF you register at using WordPress I think. I’ll just have to ask Edrard, but he’s very busy and this is not exactly high on my priority list, sorry (new design and fixing spam filter come first)

          • I am on wordrpess, waiting for a better and more viable option to open up. =) probs the best would be through wargaming-id, since it’s interesting to check the stats of those who comment sometimes.
            Basically i registered wordpress for the sole point of commenting FTR, right at the start of you moving here, just forgot my pass and didn’t have enough time. =)

      • Disclaimer: I do not encourage anyone to any actions. All of this stated in this commentary is just my opinion and is not to be used as legal advice. Any actions should be consulted with lawyer .

        As a matter of law it is a difference concerning if said person had to overcome obstacles to achieve pertinet goal or not. as it is a difference if done actions caused any and all damage.

        For example, you would be treated quite differently if you broke into someones car and stole it or damaged it (even by damaging said locks) and you would be treated quite differently if you found open car with nobody around, moved it a little and let it be in the same state it was found. If you would be arrested after it has been done, there would be no reasons not to believe your intentions and depending on other circumstances, you could leave with quite low damages to pay. While in the first case, you would probably end in prison. Each case can differ.

        In this case, although he should be aware that rules expressly state which vehicle tiers are allowed, no real damage was caused by it nor I believe he had to take any severe actions to achieve it. And additionaly, if we apply case law, when much severe actions were done in competitions where there was actual prize put on them (in gold or premium tanks, i.e. prizes worth real time currency) and these actions were resolved by just ban on access to future competitions, punishment in this case (i.e. highes possible) by WG is not appropriate.

        (Concertning law system as whole, case law does not neccessary needs to be viable source of law in country, but in EU practice of European court for human rights and EU applies it which reflects on the pratice of member state courts. So at least concertning EU players this all should be taken into account. Especially in Britain, where if players took this to court of equity, I am quite sure WG would lost this case and even would have to change their EULA or court would change it by itself. Concerning Belarus where they shit on law and justice and where still people get into prison without fair trial, yeah, this probably would not apply to Belarussian players. Concerning Russia, I have doubts court would even open such a case, as I suppose there would also be problem with fair trial, but in their case, with the right to be heard since they would probably laugh at such a case.)

        And one last thing, if said player invested money in it, it would also had to be taken in account. Even if you just rent something and keep investing in it, rising its value, it still has to be taken into account and appropriately reimbrused if it is to be taken away from you prematurely. In worst case scenario for player, the damages he had done would be deducted from his investment. For such a minor breach they are not allowed to highest punishment, resulting in loss of hundreds of €.

          • Actually, I am a law student and you would be suprised how all of this virtual bussines is binded by law. The biggest problem is ignorance of law and that damaged parties almost never turn to courts. Interesting case was with hidden EULA, being refferenced to only by few words that it exists and not actually providing it, which ended pretty badly for software licensor and as a result, today you got everywhere “I agree” button with whole EULA window which you can not skip in order to proceed with instalation etc. People just keep thinking things on internet are not property since they can be so easily obtained. And EULA is below law, EULA can not override law and if it is in conflict with it, law applies, EULA not.

            • that’s terribly vague and does in no way support the claims made in this thread.

              What kind of lawyer are you becoming anyways that you’re so familiar with the legal systems of three different countries, both in and outside the EU?

              You’re making wild guesses here.

              • Have you ever heard of European law? It one goal of EU is to harmonize law systems of all member states and it is one of the requirements to join EU to harmonize national law with it before entering it and EU does quite a good job in this field, especially after Lisbon. The main aim of EU is trade regulations and it does quite a lot focus on customers protection. Pretty much there are not so many differences in this field between law systems inside EU. And there is always European court for human rights, where you can turn to, which does not care too much about national law, it takes it into account but is not binded by that too much. Then there is also the International law subjects. We had to make reports on judgements of ECHR and other cases of international law and also on cases where citizens sued their own country or other countries and you would be suprised by the judgements in some cases.

                Every law student has to learn EU law, at least in my country. Our school also provides means to learn about other nations law system, namely UK, German, Austrian and to some extent about Italian, French, Spanish and I am not so sure but I think also Russian is offered. The latter are offered but there is not too high interest in it so they does not provide the depth you can achieve in Austrain law for example, which I think next to UK law offers the most related subjects to it. You simply had to attend some of them to pass, without them you would not have enough credits. I choose UK, sice it was the easiest for me since I undrestood that language (it is teached in their native language). Also, in the first year you got quite a lot of supplementary subjects about history and current state of systems and some were offered even in second year, although they were mostly for low amount of credits. For example I had one subject called “World law systems” where they teached us some basic even about Egypt and China for example and others. I admit I am not too deep into customers protection yet but I already passed EU law and am deep into International law, so it would be quite rude to say what I say is “wild guesses”. I have no idea where you come from and how law schools work in there, for example schools in UK and USA they are quite different from ours, so this all may be new to people from USA or other countries, but I am surprised that someone did not know at least that in Europe you had to learn about EU law and about other members national law. You really think lawyers learn only about national law?

  4. Were those guys at least notified not to do it?

    Maybe they did it once or twice just for the “luls”. A permaban for that seems too harsh to me…

  6. I do agree that exploit is stupid and should be punished, BUT permabanning people for something that’s in first place based on their mistake(bad coding) without even a warning not to do it is simply retarded and so WG style…..if they have been warned and still did it then ban is deserved, however i doubt they were actually warned because who the fuck would intentionally do it if they know they’ll get banned?!

    • If you get into a brawl in a club and knock someone out, and then you’re permabanned – whose fault is it?
      You don’t get a warning “don’t cause trouble” in every bar you enter, which in general is the same case here – the rules of the game prohibit cheating and exploiting, despite the dev’s own miss-point in the forum post.
      Sure he points out “discussing exploits” and “decompiling or modifying” but that doesn’t mean there’s no rule against cheating in the game.
      And yeah, most standard ways do not allow you to take a T10 into a 7/42 game (we tried back when it just came out) so, yeah, you actually have to do something beyond breaking up platoons and trying to auto-search with a different “active” tank, which means that thay didn’t do it accidentally.

      • Though on second thought the bug has got to be active since the test of the 7/42…which kinda escalates the case i guess…

        • Pretty sure this is an extreme case of wording, but i’m confident that if you start bashing some guy’s head inwards with one hand while holding a shot of whiskey/vodka/tequilla/anything else – they’ll kick you out fast, maybe even with the shot.

          • I never said they shouldn’t be punished, just that permanent ban is imo too much. It’s not like he did something so serious to get that hard punishment. They maybe won few battles that way and that’s it. Few days or even a week temp ban would be suficient to teach them not to do something like this in future. I’m pretty sure the bar would kick you out, but few days later they would let you in back again.

  7. If you use the bug for your own winning the permaban is correct in my book… but if you get banned for finding the bug and test it and then submit a ticket you should not be banned..

    • I dont know about russian laws, but in europe they can’t do that without returning you all your money, here laws are always on top of little and senseless user agreements, so if they ban some european who spend money, they’re gonna have to pay him back every cent.

      • They don’t have to because EULA, try reading it for a change. They aren’t obliged to return any of the money, it’s the same case with nerfing/upping prem.tanks (remember the 59-shitstorm?). And that said, they are actually allowed to ban the players for cheating and exploiting, if the exploit gives them advantage (which this case is a clear example of: not only are you using a T9 in a T1-T8 game, but you are actually doing it on purpose, since there is no easy way to do it).
        So the case is pretty easy and structured – the guys used 1337 h4x to get a T9 into a T8-game (which greatly unbalances the match) and they got banned for it.
        And somehow i’m sure that if they tried it 1-2 times and told the devs – they wouldn’t really get into any big trouble.

        Final point – i checked the 5 names (atm 5 names in list) and they seem to be completely unrelated to each other (no clans similar, no skill-level similarities) so yeah, i guess “disclosing information on ingame exploits” fits the case.

        • I’m not saying you’re wrong in this case, but generally referring to EULA is retarded. EULA can say that by accepting it you agree to become WG slave for life, and guess what, it won’t matter because EU law > eastern mongoloids. It’s simply not a valid document.

          • You WONT get your money back. Even in EU. Basically because you dont BUY things in WOT. Its NOT your property. Everything on your account, the gold, the tanks, all that shit is still owned by WG. So they can do whatever they want with that. Those discussions are going ever since F2P with pay to “win”/”speed up” exists.
            Afaik there are no existing judgement where someone would have gotten his money back after he got banned out of the game (for his OWN fault btw. sincethe broke the rules)

            • You are paying for something, no matter what the wanna say in their user agreements, so you have to get that something back or the money, believe me, I know a few similar cases with other games, the buyer is highly protected in EU.

              • Then provide us with the court orders to pay back the money spent on the game. Court orders in the EU are public. Because you’d have to take WG to court to get your money back, there’s no way they’re paying it back just because you wrote them a nasty email.

                Or: Edoc, stop posting in legal threads. You’re worse than completely clueless.

      • LOL no, if your break a games Terms of Service or End User License Agreement, and get (perma-)banned – then you are shit out of luck.

        Nothing in consumer rights law can save your sorry ass from your stupidity.

        • Sue them and you’ll see, the problem is that people accepts the stupid rules of this guys instead of going with the law, you are protected, and you will have either your stuff or your money back, depending on the situation.

          This has been the case for years, is not the first time that other companies have tried this and ended up with the law stopping them, the biggest example is blizzard with WoW accounts, which doesn’t get that much publicity, but believe me it happens quite frequently, it only requires not retarded users :)

          • bullshit, blizzard going to court has always received a lot of media attention (wowglider for example)

            no one took Blizzard to court over account fees. Especially since you paid for 30 days of gaming, and you received those 30 days of gaming.

  9. Exploiting bugs to fuck over your opponents is not allowed in any game, everyone who does it deserves a ban. If he invested money into the game and loses everything even better.

  10. We also program software for customers and sometimes things are possible that should not.
    Programmer, its not your fault, never mind! Hey customer you retard, you are permabanned!
    Ist that the way russian companies work!? If you want to get be capitalists, dont behave like communists!

  13. It’s team battles, not some huge event or competition. A month ban is enough. Perma ban is stupid for almost anything imho. Only thing I can see perma bans for is exploits that steal money/ personal info. But getting one higher tier tank in a match? Oh how the world ends!

    • indeed, the ones getting perma ban should be all those that brute forced other peoples codes, that is plain stealing and illegal in any known civilized country.

  14. Pingback: WoT - Discutii generale - Page 1310

  15. Can someone more skilled help me “How to log in here on FTR using Wargaming ID profile” ? In a posts in the beginning, it’s being discussed as possible.

  16. Noobs, thats not a real E75, it’s an inflatable decoy tank over an PZ38na that makes a loud hissing noise when hit by a shell

  18. i never would have come up with an idea of permabanning people who exploited a little on my own mistake