Hello everyone,
not so long ago, an interview with Armored Warfare producer, Joshua Morris , was published on the F2P site. If you haven’t seen it yet, go read it, it is… educational (so far, I like what Armored Warfare presents), but that’s not the point from this post. There are several points in that interview I would like to address, or rather – features, that would be great in World of Tanks. Whether Wargaming is capable of implementing them properly, well, that’s another matter.
Specifically:
- computer AI opponents: bots are currently in development for World of Tanks, so that’s good. Both games will eventually feature PvE modes – of course, how well can Wargaming do it, that’s another matter, but actually, thinking about it, having a “raid-style” PvE mode the way it was recently leaked, that’s a good idea. When I saw it first, I was like “oh, this is like WoW raiding” – I am sure the concept is familiar to MMORPG players. I really hope WG does this right.
- Sixth Sense for everybody, the delay between being spotted and the light bulb appearing being dependent on tank commander and class type: that’s actually not a bad idea. Why not have light bulb appear sooner for – say – scouts than heavies? Just a thought.
- wheeled vehicles: this is something where I have to wonder… would it be good for World of Tanks? In modern warfare (AW setting), it’s naturally useful (Stryker, of which a video was recently released being prime example). Now, I know what you are thinking: “armored cars were crap, who the hell needs that kind of thing” – well, yes and no. First of all, some armored cars were pretty nasty. I am sure many of you remember the Puma, but what if I told you that France is fully capable of having an entire armored car branch? Probably the only nation capable of having that (along with Britain anyway), but imagine – that would give France back its unique character it lost when other nations started recieving tanks with autoloaders. As for the movement model – Storm said it’s possible to have wheeled vehicles now and I know there were some internal tests conducted into it. So, who knows?
- more customization: this is something I think Wargaming should really allow: War Thunder has visual customization and AW will have it as well. Of course, there will always be idiots abusing the customization mechanism to paint swastikas or write obscenities on their tanks, but that can be solved both by filter (when it comes to inscriptions) or simply quick review (the same way bad player names are reviewed now).
- volumetric camouflage: simply put, while the AW camo/spotting system is admitted to be copied from WoT, AW developers are aware of the worst issues WoT spotting has: invisible TD’s and tanks “magically disappearing” in the middle of a field. Whether they will deal with them better than Wargaming did remains to be seen, but the concept of volumetric camouflage is clearly a step in the right direction. WoT cover system is binary: either you have it or you don’t. Volumetric camouflage means that the vehicle has at least partial bonus, if it is partially covered. Storm said in the past that World of Tanks would have such a thing as well, but that was like half a year ago and no such option is in sight or announced for upcoming patches, so I hope WG is doing something in this as well.
- artillery: notice how AW developers opted to have artillery as well, despite being aware of the WoT forum whine. It’s an important gameplay element and luckily for most of us, Wargaming doesn’t buckle under the pressure of a couple of short-sighted but vocal individuals, who feel personally offended that someone half a map away blasted them away. There is however a difference in the AW concept, they seem to have opted for the damage over large area at the cost of alpha. Whether this is the right way to go remains to be seen, but then, unless the HE model is identical in AW, artillery the module destroyer and chain detracker might not be a problem in AW in general.
To summarize: No matter how you take it, 2014 was not a good year for Wargaming.
- They said they would like to have the HD models finished this year – and we have like how many? Thirty?
- They wanted to have Havok in 9.0 and now it’s not even sure a first part of it will appear in 9.5 (and that’s late December).
- They wanted historical battles, that ended as a failure.
- Confrontation mode – failure.
- Alternative hulls – postponed indefinitely.
- New tanks? We recently had new light tanks, but previously, last new branch was introduced in 2013, a YEAR ago.
- Multicore support? Nope.
- New grass or tree or landscape render? Not really.
Sure, some things got improved, that’s true. The fact that War Thunder Ground Forces was not exactly the WoT killer everyone was looking for also helped. On the other hand, there is one more important factor in it all: World of Tanks playerbase stopped growing, even in Russia. That’s not just a guess, I have that from several sources, including a developer. They will not admit it of course, but even if you don’t believe me writing that – the signs are all there. Do you think we will ever see EU3 with the current online numbers? Combine it with the fact that Russian shop prices are tied to USD, which means that as a result of the anti-Russian sanctions (because of the events in Ukraine), as the ruble exchange rate falls, things will get more and more expensive for Russian players, which obviously means less and less profit for Wargaming. Then add the super-expensive exclusive stuff aimed at “whales” (120 bucks for a lowtier Soviet LT + accessories?), breaking some of the barriers, that was not possible before (Russian gift-exclusive tanks on sale on another server) plus the new referral program (for the first time ever, WG takes such active measures in recruiting new players besides the usual invite codes) and the picture becomes clearer.
And there is one more element to the equation. Consider this: World of Tanks was a stunning success, but World of Warplanes was a failure (even developers know that, even though noone will say it openly). Sure, they always talk about fixing it and all that, but one thing is clear: World of Tanks (including Blitz) is Wargaming’s main source of income. I am not really sure how well Blitz is doing financially, we’ll see in time I guess, but do NOT expect World of Warships to be the same stunning success WoT was. It’s impossible – the creation of WoT filled one particular niche of the market that many players (including me) desired – an easy-to-access slow paced military game, that has tanks in it (very, very important for Russia). Russia is obsessed with tanks – and that’s not a bad thing, that simply is a fact. Also, this is not from my head – this was told to me by a Russian friend of mine and it’s true – Russians are proud of their history and of their tank industry. But… how many people are into ships the way Russians are into tanks? Few. Perhaps even fewer that are into flying.
Make no mistake, I am not a doomsayer, nor do I think that “WoT” is dying or whatever, I just think that next year, some things will (or, rather, will have to) shift with more focus on the European market. That is why I think we will see the European tree in 2015 and perhaps more in that direction. I do wish Wargaming luck in this and hope this all ends up well for everybody.
But… I’ll try AW nonetheless, if I get into their beta :)
- Multicore support? Nope. hahahahahah
So many things here, So many issues, So much feedback we’ve given and no ones listened. WG really doesn’t deserve our feedback at this point. I wont play another War Gaming product.
Its not that its a “bad” Gaming Company, its just so……Russian. Theres nothing wrong with that, nothing at all, except if your NOT Russian.
To be fair, they have buffed the hell out of the germans, but making them bounce isn’t the same as making them……German? The 88mm is a joke. 132 penn, Total BS Serb and you know it. The panther Doing 135/ 240 damage, again, very few people want to fire 20 shots in a game to get a decent xp return.
Do you really think only the Rus like 390 damage? Really? Your that out of touch, lol.
The E100, omg, why cant it have the E 75 turret as its first turret? .36 accuracy, 2.5ish aim time. Why would you give it 235 AP penn?
XVM, Dude, its a good idea, but to hear some 14 yr old kid who runs whatever tank Noobmeter tells him to to get some Perfect color has to be your biggest mistake. Why would you want the player base that pays you nothing putting down the player base that pays your rent?
On top of that, Most of those blue/ green players cant play for shit with out ther buddies around to lead them. And then the whining, its not ther fault, the lag, the modds, Hacks, it never ends and its never their fault. Huge Downer.
If your Historical Battles didn’t wake you up, nothing will. Most of my friends waited 2 yrs for that mode and you come out with ISU 152′s, Totally unrealistic gun btw, 286/750, against what, a Tiger firing 132/220 parameters.
WTF were you thinking? Do you really believe the rest of the world wants to play that? Again, if that didn’t wake you guys up, this feedback will do nothing.
Listen. Most regular people don’t want to play the Germans because their some mythical super tanks, but because they were the bad guys who had good tanks against high odds and because of Excellent Military Leadership, and because they had their backs against the wall, lasted for as long as they did. You guys are loosing your Integrity/ Credibility by trying to fight the Mob.
In the end it comes down to this. Do you want to make a product that sells or do you want to try and prove some historical point thru a damm video game?
Want to make good Rus tanks, fine, make legitimate enemies………
I want you to stay in business, I love my tanks. Good luck.
Will hope too…
http://i.imgur.com/ztj40Lz.png
You can see at the bottom the French tech tree I had come up with for wheeled vehicles, probably incomplete since it lacks a lot of paper projects that I haven’t found.
can i have all the amx 50s?:3
Checking your huge ass French tree concept gave me a nice idea for Tier1 tank problem for EU Tree.
Maybe SilentStalker could bring this to someone, who may at least look at that, if it has not been proposed before:
EU tree could start from one whatever Tier1 vehicle WG want (just take the more common or mass produced one, that does not matter), and then that specific Tier1 vehicle could spilt in several other Tier1 vehicles for other EU nations and classes.
In this way we don’t lose many small and historically important tanks, and the concept of such “in between one tier” research path is already in the game since the Stug splitting.
The overall grind wouldn’t be slown down by that, as those are only Tier1 tanks.
And in this case you don’t need to make some new fancy interface for choosing your preferred Tier1 tank or scrapping most of them at all.
Just my 50 cents. :)
That… actually makes a sort of sense. Don’t think they’d do it though.
There is always the true international tank to put as a tier 1 starting vehicle, the Renault FT derivative model #285 :D
But that does seem reasonable. I adopted the multi-unit staggered approach because France has so many tier 1 and 2 vehicles, but it would be quite useful for the European’s tree and avoiding problems regarding the crew member choices and giving new garage slots.
I am actually sad that I can’t paint swastika on my tank. After all it was historical for Finnish tanks and has nothing to do with nazis. This swastika had lines horizontal and vertical.
Yea, I guess.
Sorry SS, I didn’t mean I want nazi markings or anything in any game. I just would like to mark some tanks like Finnish soldiers used to. Yeah it’s swastika, but it’s not tilted 45 degrees. It’s old national military symbol. Much like Finnish flag or coat of arms of Finland. Finnish never did genocide.
The fear of Nazi symbols really has gotten out of hand. The swastika was co-opted by the bad guys, and not only are the Finnish inadvertently paying for it; Native Americans here in Arizona have a traditional symbol that’s a reverse of a swastika. It had to be removed from a public work of art on a highway overpass.
And the silliness continues because of people’s lack of education.
I live in a state where I can legally carry a concealed gun, smoke marijuana and freely say or write anything I want.
This restriction on symbols is a foreign concept to us, one I hope we don’t ever follow. Reading about this makes me appreciate our Freedom even more.
But I get that most voters are morons and will follow an incompetent if they can speak well. The last 2 presidential elections proved that.
:) .. and I’m happy that we cannot carry concealed or not guns freely [sure there are some who have special permits for personal protection, but it is not that common]
And that’s why your country is completely screwed up. One more thing actually 2 elections before last 2. GWB was “very competent”(hmm…..nope) and he could “speak well”(what about……..no).
Wow lol not being able to paint a swastika on your imaginary tank means that tyranny is on the doorstep of freedom.
I severely doubt you can say or write whatever you want. Your Freedom is not absolute. Look up free speech exceptions in the USA.
Also, no people with swastikas came into your country, killed a ton of people and herded a load more into gas chambers. There’s a good reason its banned.
At poppavein, UK last school child murdered by a someone carrying a gun = Dunblane1996, guns banned in the UK from that moment on. Not a single school child has died in a UK school since 1996. How many American school children have lost their lives in their schools in those 18 years?
i think the introduction of french armoured cars along with an EU tree would be awesome and i reckon would make people more interested in the game. (who the hell doesnt want to speed around the map in a french armoured car with a big gun? the one things that worries me is what advantage will light tanks have over armoured cars? would it be hit point related or would it be that light tanks would be less vulnerable to HE ammo? or would it be that lights would be much better on soft terrain?)
In general – things players asked for for years, or some balancing changes.
Lightbulb in theory should give an edge to retards (in real gameplay I highly doubt).
Players have been asking for some tank customization, like for example camo net, if tank equpped. The only answer was: not and gtfo. And suddenly AW seems to offer that.
Wheeled vehicles have a lot of disadvantages over tracked ones in terms of cross country mobility, so lack of them in Worls of TANKS is not a big deal.
Somehow mentioning WoWP you miss one possibility – a mode that combines tanks and planes. Of course WG said definitely not, but WG said a lot of things and did the opposite, so this option can’t be rejected.
Of course not in an ordinary random battle, but some special mode or CW could be interesting.
This way WG would create another big sink for gold, time and credits, and maybe even bring some new players to WoWP.
WoWP itself got a new version, clans transplanted from WoT, and somehow gameplay sucks a little less than a year ago.
I already guessed that WG has problems with recruitment the moment you told us of the bonus program for bringing in new people. That is a sure fire indicator that something is not right.
And no, it has nothing to do with MM, artillery or all the other pet peeves of the loudmouths. It probably is just that some people are bored, after all it does get boring to do the same thing day after day without changes soon enough it becomes a chore instead of fun, and there are other games that are coming out. One of this is tanks in space! (actually starships but gameplay looks very similar to WoWS).
The fact that the russian economy is suffering does not help at all and it goes beyond the cost of in-game stuff. Things like food, electrical power, etc become more expensive and people have to cut some things in order to save money, including computer time.
All in all, 2014 has not been a bad year for WG but neither it has been a good year. All they can say is that they have been able to maintain their position.
I am happy that they are aware of these problems and are trying to implement fixes to it, including new game modes. I wish them luck and hope to see the results in 2015.
When you said WoT is more of chore, I agree. I for one play a tank until I get the double exp bonus and then move to the next. If I grind (no prem account) it doasn’t go anywhere and crew progress is also slow to focus on it, so I just wait for events to play more. Monthly missions would be a great direction to play more, but lately you can only complete it once a day, requiring you to play WoT 20 -25days. Tog event was only 15 days though.
Sixth sense should be changed to a skill. Delay after spotted should be like 5s at 40% and 3s at 100%.
Also optimatization needs some work. Default garage loads my GPU to 100%, while in battle it’s around 60% (WTF?). It annoying when I browse the garage or forgot to turn off WoT and it heats up my room and fans start to spin like crazy.
No multicore support.
Well said sir! Well said.
‘a couple of short-sighted but vocal individuals, who feel personally offended that someone half a map away blasted them away’ – partial informing at its best.
Most people have problems that arties blast them half a map away
a) without taking any risk or suffering retaliation
b) without needing any skill to do wtfpwn damage by simple point and click
AW will decloak arties at the moment they shoot – visible for all to see and prone to retaliation. Where on earth do you see a mechanic like this in WoT?
“a) without taking any risk or suffering retaliation
b) without needing any skill to do wtfpwn damage by simple point and click”
These are the two most irrelevant points on which to hate artillery.
a. They carry a risk of retaliation, but not from you.
b. You do need skill in order to hit a target, specially in the current gameplay.
So your anger at arty comes from the fact that you don’t like to get killed. FYI, arty does get unmasked but the problem remains since usually they are not in danger from you, but from other vehicles.
Please do tell me what you think I hate…
I’m not angry at arties and I don’t hate them. They are a piss-poor gameplay element which have a tendency of drawing the waste of the playerbase.
And my points are very relevant:
a) at the moment they are decloaked you know where they are, their exact firing lines and the safe spots from that. Your arty knows their exact position and can CB – which he should do as the moment he does CB he won’t have to deal with return fire anymore
b) so, tell me how dealing damage with an AP shell is the same as dealing damage with an arty HE shell
Please think over logically your argument before posting. You should be aware of everything I mentioned above only by thinking just one minute before posting.
“I’m not angry at arties and I don’t hate them. They are a piss-poor gameplay element which have a tendency of drawing the waste of the playerbase.”
Okay. You don’t hate them but you don’t like them either. In this case same thing, specially when people like you use the “sky cancer” moniker.
“a) at the moment they are decloaked you know where they are, their exact firing lines and the safe spots from that. Your arty knows their exact position and can CB – which he should do as the moment he does CB he won’t have to deal with return fire anymore”
This has nothing to do with gameplay and everything to do with the SPG in your team. Gameplay make the firing arty visible, and your team SPG is unable to do something because:
a. He is servicing another target
b. He has already fired and it is under the LOOOONNNGGG reload time.
c. He fires but thanks to the nerf his round goes wild.
d. He actually doesn’t care about your predicament and is busy doing his thing.
Of these points only two are caused by gameplay: long reload times and accuracy nerfs. The other two are caused by the man behind the SPG.
So the first point is a non-issue.
b) HE damage is worse than you think. In real life a big HE round can kill the crew without damaging the tank with just a near miss. WG has limited the potential HE damage to make it endurable for the players. And flash news, WG is not happy with HE damage, but can’t find a formula to fix it without making the SPG complaint worse.
FYI: Just like you, I don’t like being one shotted by a SPG. I specially hate it when they kill me within 45 seconds of starting the game, or when I have a really good tactical position and am about to kill a tank that has been brawling with me for a long time. But those are the rules of the game. Frustrating? Yes. Broken? No.
a) The part that is important that he decloaks. The first shot of arties is the most important in this scenario – and they have to balance delaying it (more chance for the other arty to fire) to firing (dealing damage to get xp/credits). You can be dead sure about two things though – WoT style whack-a-mole in arties gets you fragged after your first shot. CB is actually meaningful. Both these result in a heavy shift of damage received from tanks to arties (and I wouldn’t be suprised if arties would have much more ‘normal’ hp pool in AW).
I’m not talking about immunity to arties when I say arties are crap. I’m saying arties are crap because currently all they do is shoot normal tanks – and normal tanks don’t have the chance to do anything about it. In WoT the best playstyle for arty is to shoot at everything that gets spotted. In AW (with the current info) his best interest to kill the other arty FIRST then shoot the tanks.
b) Nah, not really. Arty shells were largely useless against tanks if they didn’t score a direct hit. Shockwaves have this habit of going around tanks instead of doing stuff to them.
Truth be told I rarely get oneshotted by arties (or damaged at all). I wouldn’t count myself a good player if I was unable to react and handle the situation. I however simply detest what arties do to this game and the meta. It’s bad, bland and frustrating.
just one important thing – imagine the arty situation, arty decloaks when it shoots. OK, now imagine having 5 arties in your team doing no damage whatsoever (and in the enemy team the same), because they all wait for the OTHER arties to shoot and decloak to have a go at them. so 10 players in the game are waiting, and waiting, and waiting.
and now imagine a situation, when your tank teammates are not as good as the enemy team (happens all the time), and allow a scout to break through, and reveal your arties positions. so the enemy artillery shoots at yours, decloaks, but there is no one to destroy them, because all your arty support is gone. and since they (enemy arty) have nothing to fear they rain shells on you with a happy smile. again, 5 players in your team have done no dmg, because instead of shooting at the enemy tanks they were waiting, you know for what, afraid to shoot so they wouldn’t reveal themselves.
i don’t think that’s something i’d like to see in WoT..
“You do need skill in order to hit a target, specially in the current gameplay.”
Noone needs skill – pure RNG. I guess it’s not a big deal to put highlighted green spot onto a tank. Yea, you can start about inclination where the tank stands and so on, but in fact, in 99% of case, it’s only RNG which decides where your 1000ish-possible-damage shell lands. Ideally on a tiny rock top which covers 0.5% of aiming circle. There’s no skill involved.
FYI – I did play arty, I’ve got two tier X. Too easy, too boring.
“Most people have problems that TDs blast them half a map away
a) without taking any risk or suffering retaliation
b) without needing any skill to do wtfpwn damage by simple point and click”
Tell me how hiding behind bushes and sniping with 0.3x accuracy, 300mm pen, 750 alpha guns is the epitome of skill.
You can even say the same about medium tanks. T-62A is a sniping machinegun of doom if you play it like a happy camper. Tell me how clicking on your mouse every 6 seconds qualifies as skill.
I see you coming with “but they have to move!”
Yeah, because arties don’t? Because a T95 does? Because a passive spotter moves?
I’m betting AW’s artys will be much more mobile. After all, they’re modern vehicles, not oversized guns slapped on under-powered and overburdened heavy tank chassis.
When they decloak, they’ll be able to move a bit. Try and do that. Try to evade anything in a GW Type E or SU-14.
Please be so kind and do calculate the ratio of shooting distance to spotting range of a TD, and the same ratio for arty.
Please also list the number of hard covers that will be between you, a TD shooting at you or an arty shooting at you.
None of us know about how mobile arties will be in AW. Sure they might run around with 50 km/h, but you really think shooting an arty piece is just stopping and letting it rip? Even a short setup-teardown time can introduce a whole new style of gameplay. Why do you think the only way a game is enjoyable is like it’s in WoT with it’s finger of god totally unrealistic arty?
Also, the part about arties having better aim time at spotted targets is great. I don’t understand why WG didn’t think of this.
There is more skill involved in hitting a target with arty than with a JP E100.
With the JP E100, or any other Tank/TD, all you have to do is put your target in the reticle, aim for the weak spot and fire.
With the SPG, you have to put the aiming circle in the spot where you EXPECT the round to land. The aiming circle is stupidly large, Then you have to calculate if you fire when the aiming circle is getting smaller or just fire and hope that the round hits. Any obstruction will interfere, even those that are far away from the target. Of course, the odds of the target moving and causing a miss are high since the shell has a slow speed. As one of the developers said, one must be a masochist when playing a SPG. But the rewards are high, because despite all the stuff STACKED against you, you manage to hit and perhaps kill a tank.
From your point of view, all the SPG driver had to do was point and click. But if he actually did that, he would spend all his ammo and hit nothing.
I usually don’t play SPGs. I have two Tier IV SPGs and they seldom see action, but now and then I like to take them out for a ride and have to deal with this stuff.
I disagree with you.
First, let’s go into actual details a bit more. Due to gun arc TDs are a bit more prohibitive than arties – simply because they are closer and gun arc covers less area.
Second arties have to target in two dimensions – they are always watching stuff topdown. This might not sound as a big deal until you realize how often you are shooting at uneven ground with TDs – and how often you have to target something that only has the sky behind it. If you ever did, you know what I’m talking about and how tricky it is to land a shot with auto elevation.
Third due to stupid camo system your sight will be obstructed. You will be behind a bush, he will be behind a bush, you have to target a weakspot from outlines only – and you have to hit a weakspot WHEN your shell hits. Sure, travel times are about third-quarter of an arty – but they don’t bounce.
I know what targeting with an arty involves. You have to hit something with a few seconds of travel time. The human brain is capable of that. Sorry, but that’s not skill. I don’t want to be rude, it’s only a biological fact – if someone has difficulties hitting moving target (s)he probably has brain damage. That’s so much of a natural skill of humans.
About weighting probabilites – that’s not skill. That’s decision making. The jpe100 has to make several decisions throughout the game which arties simply don’t need to. For starters to deploy on what flank. An arty only has to turn. He is unlikely to be able to switch flanks.
When a tier 10 heavy can be one shotted while moving at 30+KPH and behind LOS from TDs, that is a broken mechanic. I will grant you that to do really well in SPGs, one needs skill, but when the average tomato can do better in a SPG than any other tank, that is a broken mechanic. Arties is more about RNG than skill on hitting targets. Either return the smoker tracer or unmask to all on the mini-map or some other means to add to make play a SPG a bit tougher than sitting back and clicking the left mouse button with one hand while eating Cheetos with the other hand. Saying playing arty takes skill any where near as much as playing a regular tanks, even TDs, is just delusional. And yes I’ve played arty, I find it boring and unchallenging.
@SMS-CannonFodder:
1. You cannot hit a tank without LOS with a TD, HT, MT or LT. That is the only advantage a SPG has.
2. I’ve hit fast moving targets with TDs, HTs and MTs. It is called leading the target and it is not a broken mechanic. This is the reason why I use the Hardscope Sights as opposed to JimBo’s. JimBo’s Sights are nice and look spiffy but as sight are near useless. You can’t lead a target with it. Hardscope are copies of real tank sights and you can use the markings to lead a target and hit them even while going at flank speed. Tl;dr: Lead a moving target and you will hit it. Same mechanic for hitting something while you are moving.
3. The “average tomato do better with a SPG than with a tank” statement may have been true before the big arty nerf. Now, not so much. The average tomato will spend ammo and hit nothing with a SPG except when the dice roll on his favor and he hits something. What I think about SPG players is that about 40% of them do not want to be in the front lines trading shots with other tanks. so they choose a vehicle that allows them to fight from a safe position. It is not different from those guys who remain “guarding arty” in their top tier heavy. The other 60% really like SPGs and will improve their game, becoming greens in the end. Those are the dangerous ones.
4. Unmasking the arty position on the map will do jackshit to your tactical position if you cannot reach him without dealing with the other tanks firsts. This is why the endgame of a given battle is the “Great Arty Hunt.”
5. I don’t find playing arty boring, but frustrating and you depend so much on your team that it is not funny, specially on random.
The difference between snipers and artillery is that, if you have half a brain, you can usually avoid the areas which can be targeted by long-range snipers. Artillery can shoot over things, therefore making it near impossible to avoid artillery without directly camping behind tall hard-cover.
Snipers can be countered by scouts. Snipers need a direct line of sight to their enemies, which means, if they get spotted, they are in high risk of taking return fire. Artillery on the other hand, DON’T need a direct line of sight to their targets and can easily hide in a ditch or behind cover with complete impunity.
“Tell me how clicking on your mouse every 6 seconds qualifies as skill.” Snipers have to aim at weakspots to do any damage, artillery just fires and the HE takes care of the rest… Hell, they don’t even need to hit the damn tank to do 500-900 splash dmg.
Anyone who says snipers are like arty are complete fools.
I never said that snipers are like arty. I am saying that playing SPGs is not as easy as “point and click.” It requires a different skill set but you do need skills.
My contention is that nobody likes being killed by something you can’t see, which is the main reason behind the “NERF TDs THEY ARE OP!!!!” rallying cry.
If we had the equivalent position of SPGs in real sports, it would be like having a bench-warmer throw a ball at your nuts every 30-60 seconds without being able to do anything about it until the last 10-15% of game-time left.
Lets compare normal tank x arty:
CLICK | yes – YES
lead the target to hit | yes – yes
relocate | yes – yes
blind shoot | yes – yes
move | yes – barely
gun depression/elevation problem | yes – barely
face 2×1 at the same time | yes – almost impossible (at the same time)
map awareness | yes (alot) – yes (not so much)
angle your armor | if you have some – no
aim at weak spot | yes – no
push/attack | yes – seldom relocate
flank | yes – seldom relocate
RNG dependant | yes – even more
shots have to hit | yes – not really
don’t expose yourself too much | yes – no
spot | yes – rarelly
be carefull about being spotet | yes – not really
be carefull about your hp | yes – no
find some cover | every time – just once
peek a boo | yes – no
try to look between all the foliage | yes – no
Now you tell me, is that so hard to play arty? You understand why we call it clicker? Normal tanks do everything arty does, and MUCH more, thats why we say that arty needs no skill.
It does take skill? Yes, but its minimal skill compared to any other tank
OBS: sorry if i forgot something, it didnt take me much time to do that list
You can also add that the Cyprus bank bought by WG didn’t pass the EBC stress test. Which means more money to make it healthy ;-).
Y.
May someone from Wargaming see this. Preferably Serb :)
“bots are currently in development for World of Tanks”
Excuse me?? I’d tell them to stop looking any further.
Its clear AW is now looking for ways how to implement arty without making the same mistakes WG did.
Anyway I’d like to know why is arty so important in WoT. At least half of the games today are without arty and on city map its useless. And after 8.6 there were almost none and those were happy times.
Because WoT in its heart is a not so casual game. Penetration mechanics, angling, indicator showing nominal pen chances, normalization, weakspots, camo and critical hit locations are very important aspect of the game. You need knowledge and experience to perform well.
For playing tanks WoT has a relatively low skill ceiling (you don’t need great reflexes or dead sure aim), but it translates awareness, knowledge and strategic sense good.
Or you can play arty which is (or rather was) hassle-free – just hover the crosshair over that tracked idiot, press a button and something happens.
So WoT can offer an alternative to those that can’t or don’t want to learn by playing arty. What they fucked up royally though is that one plays at the expense of the other.
Its a good idea to have a “noobtube” in PvP MMO game but its not a good idea to allow scrubs grifieng other players. The same could be achieved if HE shells were more relevant option for tanks. Now they are useless except on KV2 and such.
Wg must more work on wot. this is clear. Agree about article. SS writed nearly neutr.
” there will always be idiots abusing the customization mechanism to paint swastikas or write obscenities on their tanks”
penises, penises everywhere…
My tog would have a huge … gentlemen sausage… along its side :P
I’d really love to see more customization.
I know, there are more important things to fix, but his would kind of give the game more depth, rpg elements or whatever. Lets say once you got the vehicle elite, you can either grind xp to convert, accelerate crew training, or grind cosmetic accessories.
More camo patterns, actual visual things you can attach to a vehicle… logs, spare wheels, tracks.. something like that. Something to personalize your most favorite vehicles..
But on the other hand, I dont like the ida of “player created camos” .. pink camos and shit would take away the games look and feel
Things that would make the game better for me:
-All tanks in HD (looking at a tiger 2 makes me feel my eyesight is worse than it actually is – and its bad)
-better optimization (i.e. the hud kills my fps more than the game itself)
-more interesting, historic tanks
-no arty and autoloaders (call me a noob and a whiner but the game would be much more enjoyable if my ru251 could not be clipped by a tier lower frenchie or my tog one shot by arty)
-more damn maps
-a custom garage – make the garage upgradable and customizable as much as the tanks are i.e. you strat in a field tent, buy a garage, buy tools that make ammo and repairs cheaper, hire mechanics that do the same, put flags and junk around… how hard can that be?
-everything on customization Bugii wrote on the post above
If you can’t deal with autoloaders that is your own problem, the rest of us figured it out in 2011.
Oh i bet you feel mighty proud of yourself and i bet you did wonders to an autoloader with a ru 251 back in 2011. Now if youre done talking down on a novice player i would be gratefull to Know what exact strategy you use to fight any light autoloading french tank while driving a tank with 20mm of armor? Angling armor? Hull down? Side scraping? Please… Ony viable option i see against a tank with equal armor and speed but that can shoot 6 shots while i fire 2 back is running away and that makes scouting impossible (the ru is a scout after all) and my grind to the leopard a long one…
Be helpfull to others, not a stock up piece of…
Autoloaders are problem only if a player is very good in it. I used to have problems against T57.. first shot detracked me and the rest killed me before I was able to repair the track.
Try to inspect the tanks that gives you most problems in tech tree.. look how many shells do they have in drum and count their shots. It’s hard but it’s viable tactic. always try to avoid encounter unless you know he’s reloading or down to 1-2 shells. It’s always better to run and hide than trying to fight it if you know you cannot win. You can also be a bait… let him chase you and lead him to your bigger brothers :)
I also dont see any problem with arties.. sure oneshot hurts but how often that happens ?
You can as well be oneshot by anything if there is ammorack explosion.
They got terrible reload time and accuracy. And if you got hit several times, its probably your fault… play carefuly, use cover, relocate with brain and avoid scouts.
Arty is changing gameplay for most tanks… you can camp all the time if there is no arty in the match.. you have to be more careful if there is.
try manuvering wierd, wiggling and loading up that amazing 100 pen HE and wreck him, your gun handling is much better than his.
- artillery: notice how AW developers opted to have artillery as well, despite being aware of the WoT forum whine. It’s an important gameplay element
Arty is not an important gameplay element in it’s current state. It is a broken, game ruining mechanic.
luckily for most of us, Wargaming doesn’t buckle under the pressure of a couple of short-sighted but vocal individuals, who feel personally offended that someone half a map away blasted them away.
Because fuck balance right? Then again you’re also the person that wants a sturmtiger branch
And guess what these “short-sighted” want WG to do with arty? I’m not talking about garbad and the like that want it removed, the people that want arty fixed want this:
There is however a difference in the AW concept, they seem to have opted for the damage over large area at the cost of alpha. Whether this is the right way to go remains to be seen
High alpha guns ruin this game. It seems like the AW devs realize this because all they do is copy paste WoT’s systems and fix what’s broken.
Damage over a wide area is retarded too. Now you’re just rewarding a clicker for missing the target.
If anything, artillery should be an off-map call-in like it is in MechWarrior Online.
I don’t see a reason for it at all, personally. Any way you do it you’re rewarding someone that doesn’t have to put themselves in any real danger. So it remains a low-risk-high-reward playstyle.
another dude who dont know how to move, how to use cover and usually sititng on same spot for 2 minutes until he got oneshot. And whining about game balance…
0.9 accuracy and 8 seconds aimtime is bad enough.
From all my 36 tanks I have one arty. Im not very good in it but I can see when a player is good or is begging me to be oneshot.
Some players really move, use cover just right.. others are sitting in one place, shooting tanks while my 3 shots miss them very close. You think he is trying to move ? No, sitting in his sniper mode and suddenly when my 4th shot hits him is crying like you. Heck I even had a match when I detracked JTiger with arty, he repaired track and kept sitting in that bush. 2nd shot killed him and he started to blame me for OP arty…
Arty is pain to play, thats why I have only one, to break stereotype gameplay, but its your fault you cannot relocate.
Its a part of the game, just deal with it.
But guys like you would rather raging and crying than learn to play and change their tactics.
Deniers deny.
Arty is bad for the game. Even Wargaming knows this. They just realized it too late and can’t remedy their own fuckup now.
Anyone who says arty stops camping is absolutely delusional.
Explain me why most of people who hate artys are good ones? Explain me why the people who push, lead, flank are the ones that complain the most? BECAUSE ARTY PUNISH the ones that actually play the game, bad players dont even bother arty, cause they are so bad that they always are behind cover doing NOTHING.
Exactly. Artillery is area denial in a game that already has the majority of the map off limits.
I find it so incredibly amusing that arty apologists say “DON’T STOP MOVING” but in the same breath say “USE COVER!”
It’s just sickeningly stupid.
I’m strongly against AI and bots but that’s probably a discussion for another article. Shortly, it will be another fail, just like historical battles were.
As for the whole WoT summary: have we reached milking stage yet?
” have we reached milking stage yet?” Actually, yes, that’s exactly what I fear we reached by now.
Then i am not the only one seeing first symptopms… It’s sad, because they could make more money with NOT milking, there is soo much to do, things that could actually improve the game and expand it.
And it makes me specifically NOT wanting them to pay anymore. Why finance anything that it’s sentenced to be killed by its own creators…?
well we already got bots in the game :D They are trying to ban them :D
anyway, as a standalone game mode, why not… sometimes its just pain to play randoms during weekends.. retards everywhere…
“When I saw it first, I was like “oh, this is like WoW raiding” – I am sure the concept is familiar to MMORPG players.”
LOL, you know, there are other games than WoW. And there have been, before WoW. WoT PvE on that Ensk map is nothing like WoW raiding, it’s a standard “tower defense”. WoW players and Rorschach test: “This is WoW.” “This is like WoW”. “Just like in WoW”. “WoW”.
wtf do wargaming even do? All the other games i have played there seem to be useful updates each week/month…but with WoT it seems as if most of the updates are half-arsed or just dont do anything good…and then once a “good” update does appear…delayed -_- “our stronk rusek team is not interess in gaem”
I hope they will add smoke screens, it will add more tactical options to the game
nope, it will mess up fps a lot and just lag…
only if you want your smoke in HD
Reading that interview makes me even less interested in AW than what i already was.
Also the dude is evasive, the interviewer ask some very simple A or B question yet the dude goes on bullshit tangents.
same stupid wot-style spotting system=wrong, bad, shit, showstopper.
” but we felt having hit points, combined with critical system damage, gave the best result for portraying damage to the player.” –>ehh no, that’s siema shit, same with spotting, hitpoint=arcade shit.
“We don’t really want separate players into different groups. We really want to create a good mix that appeals to all gamers.” —> hahahaha, no… nope… no no no, it won’t appeal so smart players that want CORRECT DM AND BALLISTICS
so AW, blacklisted, it’s the same as wot with different vehicles
Well the game is not even in beta yet, I doubt they can be more specific. WoWs went throught the same stage.
yeah but basic gameplay mechanics are not likely to change as those are the cornerstones like:
Damage mechanics/model mechanics, in which they went the tard way of “hitpoints” and a “semi realistic” penetration/dmg system, but ltimately based on hitpoint ablation instead of terminal ballistic simulation like in WT
spotting system is also a cornerstone of the game, granted, it’s one that can more easily be changed later
so far feels it looks like “wot: modern warfare” and that’s why i’m not eager for it, one wot is more than enough for me.
will wait for OBT so as to judge a more polished game but i highly doubt i’ll spend any time on it
Guillermo you’re all wrong and WoT proves that. You can go over to War Thunder any time but there’s a reason people prefer WoT.
i’m not wrong at all and WoT proves that being a fail of a game catering to retards.
and knowledgeable people prefer WT because it’s REALISTIC
You could just say the following :
“I don’t like the arcade style of gameplay, hit point systems are not my thing.”
You know…like an educated person would…
Simple, easy, easy to write.
Instead you opted for the option that makes you look like an illiterate, confused, insecure teen who can’t tell the difference between different games. WarThunder and Armored Warfare…You can notice the difference in the names, w-a-r-t-h-u-n-d-e-r and the other one : a-r-m-o-r-e-d w-a-r-f-a-r-e …see, the difference in names signifies different games that have different ideas. And these ideas are not determined by you. Simple.
Now learn how to express an opinion and stop embarrassing yourself.
i’m not embarrasing myself at all.
i expected AW to be a simulator game, it’s arcade trash
I think I will definitely give AW a try. Reason being I am sick of my favourite German vehicles being made “historically accurate” (i.e slower, easier to pen, easier to ammorack, set fire to etc than was actually the case) – while all the Russian stuff is apparently made of bounconium and fitted with turbo-charged Formula 1 engines. Especially annoying is the Obj 268 – you know the one – that 8ft tall high speed TD which in reality was taller AND slower that the Jagdtiger.
Stalinwood and Leninshells!
problem with WoT, it has not end content gameplay, once you get to T10 end of game… and the grind is ridiculous…
“luckily for most of us, Wargaming doesn’t buckle under the pressure of a couple of short-sighted but vocal individuals, who feel personally offended that someone half a map away blasted them away. ”
Just name and shame me.. I don’t mind… but no.. its nothing about “personally offended”, as for many reasons stated above by others, arty is fucking shite in its current form.
Remove it or fix it properly…
It’s only WGs’ fucking stubborness that prevents this game from moving forward properly….
Hummm. They are gonna sky cancer. Doesn’t seem to have learned much. Although it appears to have a better and more realistic approach, high reward for little to no effort is always a bad idea.
“- artillery: notice how AW developers opted to have artillery as well, despite being aware of the WoT forum whine. It’s an important gameplay element and luckily for most of us, Wargaming doesn’t buckle under the pressure of a couple of short-sighted but vocal individuals, who feel personally offended that someone half a map away blasted them away. There is however a difference in the AW concept, they seem to have opted for the damage over large area at the cost of alpha. Whether this is the right way to go remains to be seen, but then, unless the HE model is identical in AW, artillery the module destroyer and chain detracker might not be a problem in AW in general.”
Seriously, do you actually believe the garbage you just spouted?
Of course he does.
Maybe if WG mixes battles like in WT.. More planes players to pwn tanks ^^
Personally I feel there is a larger fan base for naval combat than there is for tank combat. The issue is that there hasn’t been a GOOD floating camera naval game since Battlestations, but even that had a LOT of limitations and not that much depth or customization. There was Navyfield but as a top down naval game of complete and utter unrealistic proportions, including passing through ships, it is an utter flop.
I know about 70 people from my WoTclan, and another 30 or so from our old NF fleet alone, who will at least play WoWS to some degree.
“-It’s an important gameplay element and luckily for most of us, Wargaming doesn’t buckle under the pressure of a couple of short-sighted but vocal individuals, who feel personally offended that someone half a map away blasted them away.”
You are a scrub
The comments from arty haters makes me think arty is the neccessary balancing element of the game. The only way to keep those uber l33t manchildren in line…
So ruski market is going down!
Muricans too “proud” to play ruski game! maybe that’s why they are so few!!
And Europe, which ruskies hates us the most and they tried to give us as less as possible!
So ruski now doesn’t want to sucky sucky for 1 dollah, cause it ain’t working no more, now it wants to sucky sucky for 1 euro!
With the WoT being basicly the only real game they made (you seriously can’t count in WoP lol) I wonder how it’s gonna be with WoWs. That alpha is going for ages now, and they are kinda weird about it. Just look how other game developers go with it, games like Armored Warfare, Elite Dangerous, Spacecitizen, Witcher 3 and more of all this cool stuff that’s coming soon to us, most of those still in alpha phase but we have shitload of gameplays with HD models and stuff, in some cases even easy acces to alpha if u have enough money. And what about WoWs? A few pictures and “game renders”…
“When I saw it first, I was like ‘oh, this is like WoW raiding’ – I am sure the concept is familiar to MMORPG players. I really hope WG does this right.”
Cool. Large maps with multiple “wings” for PvE might actually be interesting.
In fact, a good PvE system can take a lot of the frustration out of the game, if implemented properly. Since AI tends to be predictable, PvE tends to fold out the same way every time, and there’s a lot more room for planning.
Although you still won’t catch me dead calling WoT an “MMO,” because it lacks a persistent world.
“They said they would like to have the HD models finished this year – and we have like how many? Thirty?”
To be fair, though: They tried to outsource, but that was filled with problems. I recall reading that they themselves were not satisfied with the lack of progress.
“New tanks? We recently had new light tanks, but previously, last new branch was introduced in 2013, a YEAR ago.”
It’s my impression that coming up with new lines is becoming more difficult. Players don’t like “paper” tanks, and there were only so many tanks that really participated in the war. It’s a finite resource, and coming up with new tanks can’t really be done indefinitely.
“Multicore support? Nope.”
Multicore support is harder than most people think. I’ve done a bit of multicore programming, and getting the cores to communicate with each other while avoiding situations like deadlock is not easy. Also, not everything can easily be distributed among cores. Many algorithms require things be done in a certain order, and you end up with one part of the algorithm waiting on another, which means it’s sitting idle for a bit. Such a situation is not easy to resolve with multiple cores.
“World of Tanks playerbase stopped growing, even in Russia.”
I’m not surprised:
* We could be reaching a saturation point. There are only so many people interested in a WWII tank game. It’s a lot of people, sure, but sooner or later every product reaches a saturation point.
* The game has some glaring weaknesses that frankly prevents me from convincing people from joining.
1) The difficulty curve for new players. You join the game with a fresh new tank, with stock systems and no knowledge of the mechanics, and get blown away by invisible enemy tanks. Furthermore, since the player is completely new, that player has a very low win ratio and has probably died in nearly every battle. Nearly all of my friends leave the game permanently after the first few battles because of these factors.
Frankly, you need hundreds, even thousands of battles to learn enough about the game to not suck. But, most people will make their judgement of the game in less than a dozen battles. It’s a very steep learning curve.
2) In fact, these mechanics are frustrating even for experienced players. The spotting mechanics have a strange design that allows tanks to basically have “cloaking devices” and disappear in the middle of an open field when everybody is watching. Who is not frustrated by this?
3) I’m seeing an increasing number of players get weary of grindy games. And let’s face it, WoT is a grind. I don’t have a single tier 10 myself, and I’ve been in this game for over a year.
In fact, I’ve pretty much given up on grinding for tier 10. The higher tiers aren’t really much more fun than the middle tiers.
4) The game is damn repetitive. The map variety is quite abysmal – we need about 10 times as many maps to keep things interesting. Also, since you have to grind out the tiers, you end up playing the same tank hundreds of times, not because you like the tank, but because you want a tank further down the line. Lack of map variety + very grindy tech tree = very repetitive experience. Frankly, the game is losing its appeal even to me, even though I stuck with it over a year.
Sorry for the rant, but the game is frustrating at times. And, frankly, this is why I still retain my subscription to WoW. I can grind out an alt in that game in a fraction of the time I can grind out a tier 10 tank in WoT. And since it’s a persistent world, I’m constantly moving to new areas as I level. It’s not repetitive or boring.
In fact, here’s a suggestion: Give each battle tier one or two unique maps, or unlock a new map at each tier. There are unique maps for the lowest battle tiers, why isn’t this done the whole way?