Jingles’ Review of Panther 88

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Hello everyone,

the day before yesterday, Jingles made a review of the Panther 88. I think it’s a solid review, pointing out the flaws and good points of Panther 88, so check it out. It’s actually quite long though.

 

 

There is one part though (well, as far as I noticed) where Jingles is not correct. In the first battle, he states that this vehicle has very good camo factor. Well, actually, it doesn’t.

A proof for this statement can be found on Russian forums. You see, there’s a group of players, who dedicate their time researching the camo factors of ALL the vehicles in the game (well, at least those they can get their hands on). Their testing method is sound and it’s been going on for over a year. In case you are interested in various vehicles’ camo and the methodology used, I explained how it works in one older post.

According to this reseach, the Panther 88 actually has worse camouflage than Panther and Panther II – in fact, it has the worst camo factor than every other German medium tank including E-50. The original data can be found here.

My guess is that Jingles just got lucky with spotting. Basically, Jingles’ conclusion at the end is that while this tank makes a lot of money, it also has weak armor and the gun is not so good in tier 10 battles (the FCM 50t is better in many aspects AND it has limited MM). Whether it’s a good purchase or not, that I leave up to you, but I have one more argument for you:

According to Vbaddict, out of all 14 tier 8 premiums, Panther 88 is on 13th place with 48,55 percent winrate (the best out of “regular” premiums are IS-6 and FCM 50t). In net income, according to the same source, Panther 88 is 9th out of 13 (13 because the T95 premium data are missing), while FCM 50t is 4th. Panther 88 is earning only 60 percent credits of the Jagdtiger 88, which is actually cheaper in the premium shop currently.

As such, I still cannot recommend buying it. The fact we had no option of testing it during 9.5 test along with its steep price and problematic results… there are better way how to spend 40 Euro.

53 thoughts on “Jingles’ Review of Panther 88”

  4. It’s good for skirmish battles. some of my clan mates bought it just for that and it works well.

  5. Camo rating :
    FCM : 4% when stationnary, 2% on the move
    Panther 8,8 : 9% when stationnary, ~7% on the move

    On both tanks the camo rating is pretty bad although the Panther’s camo rating is a bit better.

    • He’s just a post-midlife crisis dude with a very good sense of humor and a disturbingly huge collection of girls und panzer dolls.

      But seriously, he’s a cool dude (well, man actually) who’s good at world of tanks and is very entertaining overall.

      • And let’s stress the fact, that he is just “good”. He’s not very good, he is not great. He is just good. But he is hilarious and has many very interesting and funny stories to tell.
        And he tends to make mistakes in the commentary. As far as I know it is because while he records it, he only sees the replay itself in a small window on the screen, so he might get tanks mixed up as he doesn’t see the name too well. (And he is 44 already. ;p)

        • He is not even good. He just platoons up with some very good people.
          He has a good voice, but funny? I don`t think so.

          • well,Jingles is above average player in wot(due to his stats)..he was doing videos on YT long time before he was platooning with great players(QB,Circon..)
            ..but anyways, imho Jingles is entertainig as hell,but I can understand not all likes him, I mean its same as with music,ppl likes diferent genres :)

            • I don’t want to argue too much about Jingles since he is not that interesting.
              But since you mentioned his old videos, just take a look at them. He was raging so hard while doing noob misstakes. And QB mentioned he wanted to platoon with jingles so he would not get so angry. Since then he has calmed down a lot and his stats improved considerable.
              That is what platooning with very good people does.

  7. Also one week after release those vbaddict stats are useless for a new tank:
    Winrate is based on only 50k battles (every other premium got at least 200k and even than theres enough room for errors).
    Credits on the other hand is based on only 2000 uploaded games. Thats way to low number to take those statistics serious.

    • maybe it’s not accurate statistics but it’s good sign to hold with purchase for a while.

  8. i got a panther 88 and i do like it. I think it is better in most ways that i want then the panther2. I eaven think we could suspect a little buff for the panther2, because off powercreep its stats are not that good anymore

  9. i still don’t get why people care about camo value. It basically has no effect, if you are in a bush, you won’t get spotted if you aren’t in one you will, basically that’s the matter, and there might be saome tanks, like the e-25 with very good camo, so they won’t get spotted so easily in the open, but if they start to shoot, they will end up getting spotted.

    • Ever heard of the 15m rule? The E-25 behind the bush could just back away far enough and punch the enemy while remaining hidden(that’s what I always do when I have a bush to kemp)
      While other huge tanks , in this case , the Panther 88 and FCM could be spotted faster in the same circumstances

    • Except that that didn’t used to be the case before they butchered the maps.

      A 100% camo crew could mean the difference between getting spotted at 400m or 350m when firing. Kind of a big thing, don’t you think?

  10. Jingles is like “203 pen is shit, look at this!” and compares it to the two newest tanks (Centurion and Indien). What about the Pershing with 180, or T-44 with 175 or T-34-2 with 181 (I think)?? All those tier 8 meds see tier 10 as well, and I don’t see anyone complaining.

    • Well pen on T-44 and such is quite ok if they are played properly (anything but facing armored tanks from front) however for some T10′s where even side armor is problem there is always gold ammo.
      Using gold ammo on premium tank somewhat beats the purpose of tank itself which is silver farming.

    • The difference is that those tank can either flank the enemy or tank a bit of damage with the turret. The Panther can’t really do either.

      • What are you smoking? T-44 tanking? Even a stronger spit from any TD from tier 7 upwards will pen it, anywhere. It is a fun tank if you play it like a ninja, that means staying undetected as long as possible, flank, hit and relocate as fast as you can.

        • Ye’ it’s a side sniping flanker. It’s got great gunhandling and has good camo rating. Too bad the guns penetration is bad enough that punching through the sides of some(german/soviet) tier 9 heavies is a problem. Heck, the accuracy isn’t that amazing so it can actually hit the spaced armour on the IS-3 and WZ-111 when shooting the side and get absorbed due to how bad the penetration is.

          Honestly I’d never play the tank to improve my stats, carrying games in a 416 or STA-1 is much easier. T-44 is just great fun in the tier 8 matches it sees, which is often thanks to broken-low matchmaking weight.

  11. SS, that comparison is a bit flawed…
    Win rate is directly coupled with ability to carry a game and let’s be honest any current tier 8 medium, even non premium one will have hard time to carry a game in comparison to even premium tier 8 heavy (SuperP, IS-6 or FMC with limited MM make producing good win rate even easier) as tier 8 tanks have generally worst matchmaking in WoT due fact that tier 10 cannot meet any higher tier and tier 9 have “limited” MM too, so tier 8 tanks tends to see far less games as top in comparison to even one tier lower tanks and 88 isn’t really very useful in tier 10 unlike Centurion which gun in combination with with stronk mantlet provide for Centurion more options to carry a game.

    Even Panther II is not especially great medium in comparison to tier 7 Panther, which is at least capable change course of battle as top in MM, so what you really expect from premum which have to be even less capable than Panther II in first place?
    And yes I think that Panther II is bit UP with his crappy mobility in comparison to a better in it’s tier Panther on tier 7, which isn’t considered OP AFAIK.

    • Please tell me more how the ability to carry a 15 vs 2 battle is directly coupled with win rate. Win rate has nothing to do with this, when the team is retarded u lose- your wun rate lowers even if you are the best player

  12. i really like how he’s saying it’s crap but still he has one and he bought one… i have no idea why people love it when a company like WG is asking for money to piss on your face. seriously, who the hell pays for this garbage tank and why? i would rather buy all low tier premium tanks instead of this one and i am a german tank lover.

    • Because Jingles will make much much more money back from a video on a new tier 8 premium tank review than it ever cost him to buy in the first place.

      That and he’s freely admitted he has more money than sense right now and very little expenditure other than games and models…you should see his spending spree when he went to Bovington’s gift shop.

      • You are a moron,he didnt even bought the tank just like Circon,Reilin gifted to both of them.And Jingles doesnt give a flying crap about how muc money it makes from videos…..

        • Well, that escalated quickly.

          Care to point me to where I said that he cares about how much money he makes? All I said was that he doesn’t have to worry about the cost of a premium. He’ll make way more back on a video from it that he won’t have to concern himself with it. That’s not trying to imply he’s a moneygrabber, that’s just common sense of outgoing/incoming and I’m sure Jingles is more than aware of it.

          In short, chill dude. You’re reading things between the lines that aren’t there.

      • ok , i understand now. thought he actually loves the game and tanks so much that he buys everything no matter how crappy it is. if he actually makes money out of this game, that’s pretty damn cool wish i knew how to do that myself :)

  14. Got the tank, all i can say is its not a good tank, fcm50t is much better. İf they buff 88s mobility it could be a good choice but now its useless

  15. Simple true for me about premium tanks …

    If i will eventually in long future decide to grind chinese tier 9 WZ-111 Model 1-4 (i dream about him all the time) – i will play 112 (i have him but he doesn’t fit me soo i am not driving him at all from some time now) and i will look for ways to obtain WZ-111.

    I will play then 112 even despite i do not like this tank – in compare to IS-6 (which is ok for me) and KV-5 (i love KV-5 very much fits my playing style very much).

    What i want to say ? If you have normal tanks in this type and nationality (in this case – german medium tank / tanks) you will still consider Panter 8.8 because it will just benefit your german medium tank crew / crews. Simple is that …

    Of course this is not only important element in premium tanks but very important that is for sure.

  16. Jingles just somehow still doesn’t know how camo works. He is 15m behind the tree tops between him and the enemy – he won’t be spotted no matter what the relative view range/camo factor is. Tank beside him doesn’t have the tree cover and gets blapped, simples.

  17. I have this tank. And I have a different opinion. To be honest, it is very difficult tank for people with good skills. On the Russian forum of the game there are a few strong players who praise this tank, but most people are furious. For them, the tank is very complex, as well as any medium tank 8 level. It requires skill.

    In this tank I have 62% wins, 51% survival rate, the average experience of 1100, 1900 average damage (I want to do in 2000+ soon). And I think that this is the usual medium tank 8. For me, this IMPTOVEMENT Panther 2, which brings money. This is a great tank, which requires a good level of play. This is not as easy as IS-6.

    Few my replays with “Master” and against level 10:

    http://wotreplays.ru/site/4282407#erlenberg-say_please-panther_mit_8_8_cm_l_71
    http://wotreplays.ru/site/4283737#ognennaya_duga-say_please-panther_mit_8_8_cm_l_71

  18. One thing I noticed, the Panther 88s tracks seem to eat quite a lot of shells when sidescraping and in general..
    Did anyone ever check if the schurzen are counting as spaced armor?
    I even once was hit with HESH by a FV 183 for a whopping 237 dmg, unfortunately I didn’t see where exactly he hit me. Wasn’t the gun though, at least it got no damage..

  19. I still expect the T-54 Prototype to be even worse on release than this thing.

    estimated below 40% winrate with the latest nerf when not using premium ammo.

  20. I am pretty satisfied with the Panther 8,8. The thing is, I don’t think you should put too much focus on the average numbers. The harder the tank is to play, the worse the average numbers for that tank will be (damage, credits, kills etc).

    The Panther 8,8 is, just like a lot of the German tanks, hard to master. It doesn’t forgive any mistake you make, if you get spotted and stand still while the enemy in front of you is turning his turret towards you, he WILL damage you. Bad players blame the tank for being stationary targets. You can get away with that if you are driving an IS-6 for example which you unintentionally angled. Bad players will survive in a lot of situations in such a tank in which they would die almost instantly in a Panther 8,8.

    Your WN8 is not so good? Stay away from the Panther 8,8. Easy.

    I’m dealing 1600 damage on average in this tank. 57% winrate and have a WN8 rating of 2558 on it at the moment, and I do not consider myself a very good player. I can’t get that high with the Löwe, and because of the super cheap price of the 8,8 ammunition, the Panther 8,8 makes tons more credits than the Löwe. I love it.

  21. Player who cant play properly is reviewing tanks… I mean, I am not trying to being rude or anything, but why would you listen average players rate tanks. If you want review find someone who is very good player (unicum or better), because that player knows pros and cons of every aspect of tank and not just its main features.

  23. To SS
    I watched this earlier and pointed out in commenta about the camo,
    basically he was not spotted because of that big tree between he and the target.
    We know firing within / equal to 15m from bushes / trees thats why we pull back until we no longer see a transparent bush, then fire. That give us concealment camo.

    You can argue say no source or sth. But that’s how it works. The tree covered all the spotting pots of his tank from his target, camo granted

    P.S. This thing has a better terrain resistance than a panther II, if i recall tank inspector correctly