To everyone who got excited about 9.6 supertest data being leaked to gamemodels3d site – don’t. Some of the stuff is wrong, such as the armor models of the HD tanks, those are screwed. Personally, considering most of the stuff was leaked per partes before, I think waiting for the 9.6 CT is better than drawing conclusions currently.
- Storm, commenting on the HT mission where you have to cap the base being too difficult: “There are some complications, but we’ll think what to do with it. No promises though for now.”
- many things were changed in WOT based on player surveys
- French LT’s won’t be buffed apparently, because “their situation is better than those tanks that are getting buffed”
- Aufklärungspanzer Panther (tier 7 LT) will be removed from the game and replaced by SP.I.C. (SS: oh, I proposed that almost two years ago, well, better late than never)
- the change mentioned above will happen in 2015
- it’s possible WT E-100 will be removed from the game as well, WG is considering it, as there are options now (SS: …and they are awesome. Well, okay, one is.)
WTF-e100 removed from the game, now that would cause a riot.
No, it wont.
It will only cause partying and celebration.
Agreed!
No, we’d have a party. Need to get rid of the fantasy tank junk in this game or I want a hovercraft with a gatling gun please
no just change it to the skorpion and everything would be good
didnt you hear about pzkpfw vielfach rotierende kanone auf Luftkissenfahrzeug before?
This: LOL! Especially for us who understand some german… (I don’t am not German..)
^^ Comment of the year!
Win!
Lol XD
This is what google translate told me : frequently(probably fast) rotating cannon on hovercraft
gj dude, gj !
You can have as many of those you want, specially the 7.62mm ones, if I can get one that fires a dual GAU-8 Avengers :D
What if the replacement is even cooler?
PLZ TELL US !!!
The Crocodile maybe?
Oh hell yeah ! The Krokodil ( Kampfwagenvernichter E90) Would be AWESOME !
@GetFoched: Krokodil is a fake, as well as the E90 ;-)
Isn’t the only viable replacement the WTF Panther? I mean yeah, it’s still a waffle, but it’s not much different than the others.
WTF auf Maus?
Ahahahaha xD Give me the Maus including turret and my Waffles speed and gun xDD
Tell us! Which tank?
FlaK Maus.
Fake, never existed
Well Yeah,if they completely remove it I hope we will be compensated with free XP…
You know what it is from your recent help with the Czech branch. You may or may not have proposed it.
JagdKanonenPanzer.
An E25 for tier 10.
I would kill for that to come into the game.
Its KanonenJagdPanzer, but yea, would be a viable option. It used to have a 90mm gun, but the producers claimed it could fit the 105mm. Good enough for Tier 10, if they make it a sneaky sniper.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanonenjagdpanzer
Although it would render the whole “turreted TD”-branch a bit stupid. 15° gun arc, −8° to +15° depression/elevation. Well, stupider.
But at least its a _real_ vehicle. Seems like a new concept for WG to try, doesen’t it?
gotta say 70 kmh top speed and E-25 ish camo values etc would make this tank OP 50mm at front which isnt too bad 105mm gun would have low damage
Gun
-105 mm guns have 320 damage
-276mm pen
-6 sec reload
-0.29 dispersion
-1.9 aim time
– -7,+15 elevation arc
-Gun arc 24 deg
-Ammo capacity 40
Armour
-50mm at front
-400mm something autobounce mantlet
-20mm at sides with 5 mm tracks
-10mm at back
Maneuverability
-70kmh top speed(historical)
-Traverse 44 deg
Camo
- Superb statinory
- Bad after fired
- Bad on the move
With new 0.9.6 nerf to view range and to stop this E-90 from being a damn scout it should be 350 something view range
would this be OP? i tried to balance the tank with not having armour(historical) and having a good gun(also historical) but having bad camo and bad view range tell me what should i change
E3 doesnt have turret E4 has half turret 183 has 60* something turret 4005 doesnt have full turret either so only full turret TD at tier 10 was WTE
Even cooler than a miracle camo autoloader that is currently most driven by gold only spamming (APCR) spamming bananas/tomatoes that try to pimp their stats? Barely possible, EXCEPT it would be a real Tie Fighter or X-Wing. Or the USS Defiant ;)
Not sure why you’ve apparently come across that, but I’ve not come across a single WT using APCR in pubs, and due to the high expected damage and skill level needed for the tank, it’s utterly terrible for raising stats.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD TELL US!
I utterly love the WT-E100, with 500+ games so far in it, and as long as the replacement is good, I’d agree with the replacement!
well if they replace it i want my new TD
WT Ausf.Panther with 210mm Morser or 128mm L/55 with 3 shells in drum?
http://zxhistory.blogspot.it/2013/10/germanys-ultimate-motorized-cannon.html
no come on that looks like bc 155 58 utter shit
A good riot.
So long as whatever replaced it wasn’t terrible literally no one would care. Most people driving it do it from the “can’t beat them join them” school of thought and unlike op premiums nobody paid real money for them.
As long as it’s a turreted TD, I am fine.
We don’t need another JAG E-100 clone
Spähpanzer SP I.C.
”Munitionsvorrat 18 Schuss”
My german isnt that good but i think i know damn well what that means :(
It translates as “Little bitch ass hard-to-hit ammoracking bugger 18″.
It is possible WG will increase its ammo cap
Yeh they gave the m56 14 extra shells, m12 double the historical capacity, they will buff it if need be
Don’t forget AMX 13 F3, which has a nice ammo capacity compared to the actual value of 0 – it had to be accompanied by ammunition carriers. :P
Noooo not the AufPanther…. just keep both of them, or make it premium or something.
It would be perfect with regular MM >_>
I agree!
Why remove it? its a brilliant tank and its also real(ish)
KEEP IT
Same here.
I love the auf panther as it is right now, it suits my playstyle. I hope they make it as a prem tank and even it dont earn any extra credits I would still be very happy.
A thumbs up for Mr. Lam Po Tsuen (I think it’s spell like this XD)~
Of course WG are removing it, just when they announce they’ll buff it. Here’s hoping it’ll stay a premium, though.
Yeah.
Best ramming tank in the whole game.
They should just make it premium or something, not remove completely.
I dont want to lose it totally.
I’m gonna add to this. I loved the Awfulpanther. Aside from the terrible camouflage it had a cool gameplay style as an acting medium with an insane rate of fire. The thing wasn’t the best, but it was pretty damn nice.
Mäuschen…it is AWESOME Panther! :p
+1 i really like it. it has got some soul!
- it’s possible WT E-100 will be removed from the game as well, WG is considering it, as there are options now (SS: …and they are awesome. Well, okay, one is.).
WTF Panther. Or PaK 45 Borsig-like? I cant remember now :D
Isn’t it too weak if My brain isn’t failing me?
Buff gun, buff HP. Armor is not needed.
Looks like SerB will need to halt his space stuff and create things again :D
SerB will fail me forever if his ship to the moon won’t have “how terrible” written on the sides.
Actually, translation is wrong, its SS’s creation :D
Really? What’s it originally say?
What a horror.
I think we can all agree that by now it’s so legendary noone cares about the original anymore :D
Both troll you over 9000
- it’s possible WT E-100 will be removed from the game as well
finally that cheater tank gets removed
Lmao cheater tank. What a fuckin moron.
Don’t you have anything better to do in life than to go around insulting people over your stupid pixelated tank toy?
How terrible.
Says the whiny cunt following me around posting and quoting my replies? Lmao. Stalk much, crybaby?
- French LT’s won’t be buffed apparently, because “their situation is better than those tanks that are getting buffed”
wg pls
- Aufklärungspanzer Panther (tier 7 LT) will be removed from the game and replaced by SP.I.C. (SS: oh, I proposed that almost two years ago, well, better late than never)
- the change mentioned above will happen in 2015
- it’s possible WT E-100 will be removed from the game as well, WG is considering it, as there are options now (SS: …and they are awesome. Well, okay, one is.)
Woohoo good stuff!
- it’s possible WT E-100 will be removed from the game as well, WG is considering it, as there are options now (SS: …and they are awesome. Well, okay, one is.)
anybody know what the options are?
SS does. :P
SS knows but he ain’t telling. And if he ain’t telling, then nobody does.
he is probably going to make a thread about options after WG confirms the change
The cap mission for HT’s is not the problem, it’s the get a ram kill in a HT that’s the problem, god I can’t remember the last time I did that and I’ve been trying to do it all bloody day!
I would like to agree with you , but I’m stucked on cap mission for three days already.
Somehow did it on the first try actually… and now I’m stuck on the ramming mission >_>
Did both on the first try.
KV-5 ftw
Or KV4 downhills, E75, 4502A etc :D
Bloody hell.
Driving T14. Shot up stock BDR down to 8hp up on the Himmelsdorf hill – I charge at it, 2 meters before the collision, T25 shoots it dead.
In the street beneath the hill I chase down an arty, put a shot in it, arty misses, I charge at it, the same T25 swoops in from behind and finishes it off.
Later at the cap circle there is T-15 at 15hp hidden behind the small building there. I am aproaching from the other side than the rest of the team, full speed ahead on the unsuspecting T-15, T25 kills it. And then it also kills something with 34hp that stood a bit to the left.
So yea, I got a High Caliber medal…
SS, what’s up with those news about the EU tree you were so displeased a week ago? You said, you’d write about it the last wednesday, and nothing. Something made that impossible? :)
Yeah, what’s with that? I kept refreshing whole goddamn wednesday for nothing >_>
Yeah i did that too….
so WTF E-100 -> WTF Panther?
http://static.hlj.com/images/aif/aifg-095_0.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-4qcXbhArOPg/UmKYjza1-XI/AAAAAAAAAWo/Q46A6ToBrlI/s320/WT+Panther.png
Both are perfect and not at all underpowered. Smaller, with the same amount of armour as the WTF E100 and probably even a bit faster.
I mean, who the fuck shoots the hull on the WTE100 anyway, and if they do, with the new bounce mechanics the shot bounces from front hull directly into the turret anyway :P
I dont understand logic of WG creating a tank from one sentence, with autoloader which would never fit there and hull of 200mm while turret is 20mm – and everything spins on something made from adamantium.
I know right? At least T28 prototype is believable.
The tier 9 and 10 WTs have ridiculously tiny rotation mounts, like seriously I know it’s just the gun but guns are heavy too, especially if they have a big-ass autoloader attached to them.
Because “historical acuracy”
As long as they don’t paste an auto loader to it…
I need the 150 mm L/68 gun
- French LT’s won’t be buffed apparently, because “their situation is better than those tanks that are getting buffed”
Have you ever played the 12t and the 13 75 ? The answer is NO. Fuck off WG and please play the fucking tanks before saying such bullshit.
The 13 90 is great as it is now (although a VStab would be nice).
PS : the oscillating turret means that the french tanks should have great accuracy on the move (like the americans).
13 75 is pretty okay I think. The penetration is a bit lackluster and it’s a bit sluggish, but somehow I really enjoy it.
You really said that ?
Dude AMX 13 75 have NOTHING for him when compared to M41 and even T71. No pen, no accuracy, no speed, no maneuverability. Nothing.
I have both 13 75 and M41 and while M41 seems better it’s very big compared to the AMX, also it’s ammorack is made of butter. It’s one of those tanks that looks shit on paper but just works for me, like the Comet.
Comet is nice. But 13 75 is just bad. Its gun sucks hard. M41 is OP. Just OP. You can’t even compare with 13 75.
of course I can compare it what are you on. And M41 is getting nerfed. But I still like AMX 13 75 and there’s nothing you can do about it. I’m allowed to like tanks you consider bad am I not?
You’re not alone, I liked 13 75 too, it was even my 2nd tank to get 2 gun marks in – people just suck in it. :-P :-D
It might be because AMX 12/13 was my first autoloader line, but still… I currently own T71 (that thing is just cute and I had already planned that my keepers will be T71 and 13 90), and although it looks better on paper in every aspect, I wouldn’t say its playstyle and performance in my hands are much better. :-)
But let’s be honest: why buff the one which already looks better? The vbaddict.net winrate statistics show T71 and 13 90 (I know, different tier, whatever) just above 49 %, whereas 13 75 tightly doesn’t reach 47 %. :-(
vbaddict’s stats will be lie in a week stats will go down because of suiciders
Dude, come on. It’s smaller and has better camo so its situation is better.
/sarcasm off
Yeah, just giving the Amx 12/13 a VStab will make them viable again!
I dont really remember 12t and 13 75 all that much (afair I hated 12t for some reason and 13 75 was okay), but 13 90 could use some sort of aim buff imo
12t is good, 13 75 is hmmppppfffff!!! and 13 90 is very good. So 13 75 could really use a little love :)
Just give the 13 75 an upgraded 75mm. I would be glad if that imaginary gun would have:160-170pen, 150dmg, 2,3-2,5aiming, 0,35 accuracy, full-clip (6 shots) reload 20sec with 2 sec between shooting and weight as much as the 75mm from 12t. That would fix this problem. I don’t want it more mobile but please. Give it an upgradeable gun
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfbK_dbsCu0
Stay away from my precious panthers! Even the awful ones!
It’s fair I guess, if all the stuff from above happens we’ll get a WTF Panther and the Awfulpanther gets removed. The number of Panthers stays the same.
Hmm… The SP.I.C. has 3 man crew and the Aufklärungspanzer Panther has 5.
What will happen to the 2 extra crew members?
Barracks.
Yeah but if the tank gets removed totally, there cant be any “Aufklärungspanzer” -crews at all.
Unless they make 2 x commanders and 2 x drivers for SP.I.C. And put the extra ones in to barracks. That would be completly stupid.
Because retraining automatically by WG was never done before….
I did not mean that “they cant”.
I mean it would be completely stupid to retrain them to something else you do not need, and then waste their xp (or gold) for retraining them to something else where you can use them.
Unless they make a system where they allow you to manually choose their new role for free of charge.
But knowing WG, they will not. :P
What the fuck you pondering here about? :D
You get them retrained automatically and leftover is sent to hell, I mean barracks.
Leave him be Woras, it looks like he is a furry anyway so you can’t take him seriously.
What he means is if you have the loader (example) in Auf, what will he be retrained for? Not the new tank since it doesn’t have the loader (example), maybe as commander, if he fulfills the loader duty? Or loader for Loltraktor?
I’m not sure what crew roles there will be in the new light. But I guess that these 2 extra crew members will change their role depending on what they were doing previously and what crew role combos the new 3 man crew will have. For example if there will be commander/radio operator role, then the “old” both commander and radio operator would be changed to commander/radio operator. If there’s gunner/loader role, the “old” gunner and loader both will be changed to gunner/loader role. Or if the commander is also going to be a loader then both “old” commander and loader will be changed to commander/loader. And so on. I also guess their skills would get a reset, so you can skill them up again accordingly to their new roles.
Well, at least that would be the neatest way to solve it. But hey, it’s WG. So they may go for something more complicated and/or less fair to players.
I’m not sure what crew roles there will be in the new light. But I guess that these 2 extra crew members will change their role depending on what they were doing previously and what crew role combos the new 3 man crew will have. For example if there will be commander/radio operator role, then the “old” both commander and radio operator would be changed to commander. If there’s gunner/loader role, the “old” gunner and loader both will be changed to gunner role. Or if the commander is also going to be a loader then both “old” commander and loader will be changed to commander. And so on. I also guess their skills would get a reset, so you can skill them up again accordingly to their new roles.
Well, at least that would be the neatest way to solve it. But hey, it’s WG. So they may go for something more complicated and/or less fair to players.
Knowing WG, the extra AwfulPanty crews… worst case scenario will be trained to the LolTractor.
“- it’s possible WT E-100 will be removed from the game as well, WG is considering it, as there are options now (SS: …and they are awesome. Well, okay, one is.)”
YESSSS
Another retarded moron happy at the fact that a tank being removed is somehow good news simply because that person is a retarded idiot.
Are you butthurt that much?
Thanks for insulting me over some ingame pixels. You’re such a win at life.
Unfortunately, it’s you who is the butthurt one who is ecstatic over the removal of a pixelated tank because you’re a crybaby bitchtits.
Bitch, lets introduce Krokodil too by your logic.
You mean the scary russian drug? :P
That drug would be perfectly safe if it wasn’t russian, it’s similar to heroin, but Krokodil fucks you up so much because it’s made in buckets of cement and refined through a tank engine, and then a dog pisses in it before you use it.
I’m afraid sir you just managed to sum up how:
-Russian economy
-Russian society
-Russian gaming industry
works…
Well played
Lol, nice insult on Gaijin :D
I’ll make a video comparing different suspensions in WT and maybe it’s physics. I like both WT GF and WoT, but in GF some models are really nice with 100% accurate suspension animations while others fail completely, it’s QA is comparable to WG’s when it comes to tanks.
Because the 13 75 and 12t are so good..
How can WG make a game and not see how bad they are
WTF-e100 removed from the game …. Why WG??? why? :(
French LT’s won’t be buffed …. Make buff!!! 13 75 horrible…
WG high as fuck – creating fantasy tanks and shit.
No one ever said every tank they would put into the game would be historical. Besides, look at the tanks in game that aren’t fully historical. Much ado about nothing except removing it is fucking stupid and only appeases the retarded morons.
Its pure creation. So stfu.
Okay, and? It’s. an. arcade. video. game. Not. a. documentary. or. simulation. The Waffle is a tank. This is a tank game. Not sure where your major malfunction is occurring here.
Pliss go, woras…pliss.
Why so much aggression over pixels?
chill out. And “retarded moron” is a pleonasm. Google it up.
We know what pleonasm is. We’re just not sure you’re smart enough to understand one without the other so we have to dumb it down and make it repetitive to you since you’re a stalker. And stupid.
I spent so much money on free xp to WTE-100 the day it came to the game. :( I really love it. and something better? *sigh*
“- Storm, commenting on the HT mission where you have to cap the base being too difficult: “There are some complications, but we’ll think what to do with it. No promises though for now.””
Yea while i had to play like tomato to complete it.
- Aufklärungspanzer Panther (tier 7 LT) will be removed from the game and replaced by SP.I.C. (SS: oh, I proposed that almost two years ago, well, better late than never)
According to your own post this design was brought up by someone called Okinoshima.
Oh well (TM) – yellow journalism and getting your facts straight does not mix…
Bringing something up and proposing is not one and the same…re-think this comment here, please.
- French LT’s won’t be buffed apparently, because “their situation is better than those tanks that are getting buffed”
No, shitty developer, you are just a dumbfuck and do not know the difference between something underpowered(apparently not worthy of a buff) like the 13 75 and something that already outclasses most tier 7 lights let alone the 13 75 such as the T71. How the fuck can you buff something that doesn’t need it whatsoever and ignore something that’s already outclassed by it in every way? Oh yes, because it is french, and wargaming has a logical balancing department./rant off
Any mission where you have to cap in any tank is a breeding ground for morons to fester.
hey SS what are the options to replace the waffle-tractor?
http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/437624-wt-auf-e100-replacement-wt-panther/
Ooooh is the WT E100 replacment the Waffenträger Panther Scorpion??? Or the Sturmgeschütz Maus???
Definitely not the Sturmgeschütz Maus since it would be out of place in that line. I’d be all for it as an alternative to the jag E-100 though…slower with a far superior lower plate pls.
I havnt gone done either of the German TD lines yet mainly bacause i dont like the tier 10 vehicles, give me my T110E3 anyday ;)
Would BigWorld update force them to change graphics of the game ?
For me it looked much better in 8.8 than it looks now
SS, can you make an arcticle about WT-100 replacements ?
This.
That.
Noooooooooooooo I love my Fail Panther dammit! D:
Replacement for WT E-100? With what?
Another fake tank? And what that one would bring in the game? WT E-100 is OP but it is quite unique. What they will do? German version of FV4005?
WT Panther: http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/437624-wt-auf-e100-replacement-wt-panther/
In short: Tier X Hellcat
So we will have a tier 6 Hellcat, tier 8 Charioteer, and tier 10 Waffle Panther :D
If it will have autoloader… I guess it would keep it uniqueness.
Simply for me (and I don’t have one) WT-E100 is interesting to me as it is quite unique. Seems like WT-Panther would keep it. So *thumbs up* :)
Nazi U.F.O. auf E100 replaced? Sounds good :)
- Aufklärungspanzer Panther (tier 7 LT) will be removed from the game and replaced by SP.I.C.
Can’t believe no one jumped on this…
“ZOMG-so-Racist!” :p
- it’s possible WT E-100 will be removed from the game as well, WG is considering it, as there are options now
Wow.. I wonder if they finally saw the threads about the Porsche Jagtiger GT-101 test bed. o_O
I jumped on that, can’t wait for it.
FUCK THE DEVELOPER WHO MADE HT7!!!!!
MAY YOU GET A PARARECTAL ABCESS WHICH CANNOT BE DRAINED!!!!
NOOO!MY PRECIOUS AUFKL PANTHER!!WHY WOULD THEY DO THIS?!!?
You’ll see when the SPIC comes :D
Aufklärungspanzer Panther (tier 7 LT) will be removed from the game and replaced by SP.I.C.
About time.. If they are going to do that then I think it’s time they mounted the VK 2801 turret Ausf C (that the Aufklärungspanzer Panther has) and the 7,5/5,5 cm Waffe 0725 gun on the VK 2801 as another choice!
Hopefully they will remove that WT E-100 abomination! It’s wrong and annoying on so many levels, I’ll be glad when it’s gone. :)
“french lights are okay”
That’s like saying the chinese have the best gun depression in game. The 13 75 is a shite. It’s like a non-maneuverable medium with no armor and no depression/elevation. Just buffing its agility will give it a lot more. And penetration, too. Thing can’t penetrate the ass of a maus if it wants to (believe me, I speak from experience)
Aufkl. Panther cant do that either…
And the Aufkl. Panther has gotten buffs on multiple occasions in recognition of that fact. Including the current proposal. While the 13 75… does not.
“SS: …and they are awesome. Well, okay, one is.” SS could you give list with possible options?
So, let me get this straight… Some of you guys are literally paying Silentstakler and he cant tell what tanks is plausible for replacements?
You are a real player SS
And you have no patience.
Why remove the waffle? Makes no sense I don’t play the waffle, I don’t play German TDs… I see no problem with it.. Maybe because I have never gotten clip by a waffle. And my main tank is a 113 its upper plate bounces waffles all the time …(I don’t play the waffle its a hard tank to play, takes skill to make that huge target work)
- Aufklärungspanzer Panther (tier 7 LT) will be removed from the game and replaced by SP.I.C.
Why remove it? Why not just make it a premium tank?
I use to hate it then I got use to how to play it and it’s a pretty good tank actually.
My guess is that the ‘SP I.C.’ will be nicknamed ‘the Mexican’ in the NA region, lol.
Some of the comments made here are quite good, some funny and well some just utter rubbish. I found the tier seven Lt Panther to be a pain in the ass to play that being said I just researcher the RU251 today after going through the above mentioned tank for the second time. My spotting damage improved from the first attempt with this tank and over all damage and win rate also improved. I contribute it to having a better crew and better understanding of what the tank is capable of and not capable of. I’am very glad this site is here providing information of upcoming changes and events. With the information gathered here today, I will not sale my tier seven Lt Panther as I would have, and should be credited with it predecessor when it is implemented into the game. Thank you once again FTR
:( Why remove fattypanther?
AFKpanther is a great and more importantly UNIQUE vehicle (nothing even similar in game bloated with clones over last year/two or so). Takes some adjusting to but so what tbh, if they want an alternative less challenging option why not just add the option like JagII-Ferdi choice on tech tree? No one complaining about it as an enemy tank so why remove for benefit of grumblers who won’t keep alternative either…
WG, Don’t touch my Afkpanther!
Does this mean my FOCH 155 can finally be buffed back please?? Tank is such a piece of junk since they nerfed it.
“Aufklärungspanzer Panther (tier 7 LT) will be removed from the game and replaced by SP.I.C. ”
Nooooooooooo! :(
That is the best light tank rammer. Mine is exclusively setup for ramming.
42 t weight + 85 mm frontal armour + 60 km/h top speed + spall liner + enhanced suspension + controlled impact skill
I had so many ram-kills in that tank. I even rammed heavy tanks.
And they want to take that away from me…
Flak E-100.https://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/360x271q90/913/rtJCCb.jpg
It’s a fake …
>> – Aufklärungspanzer Panther (tier 7 LT) will be removed from the game and replaced by SP.I.C. (SS: oh, I proposed that almost two years ago, well, better late than never)
FU, unless you give it to me as a FREE premium. 900 battles and counting, i think i deserve it :P
Damn bugged mission….HT-5, top 3 of damage done in your team…..5 times in row in T32 top damage dealer of ALL 30 people…no mission accomplishment. FU WG!