Superpershing armor change from Test 1 to Test 2

As mentioned in the patchnotes, the lower strip of very thick armor was prolonged. In Test 1 it looks like this:


Test 2 version:

T26E4 SuperPershing_17-54-35

As you can see, the red zone is noticably longer.

48 thoughts on “Superpershing armor change from Test 1 to Test 2

  1. Does this extended down to cover the LFP as well? if you look at the Super in real life and the model in game, the 2nd set of spaced armor covered a large portion of the LFP.

      • I am happy that there is info at all but I noticed that the scale for the different pictures (x.1 vs x.2) is often different. So same color usually does not mean same armor. Just in case there is a way to feed back thanks and info – it would be awesome if the different pictures could use the same color coding.

      • Shame, hopefully we can convince them to change that as well to reflect where the armor extended to.

          • Agreed. It’s still not what I had hoped for. Usually end up spamming gold, which results in lower earnings and defeats one of the reasons for a premium tank @ Tier 8.

            Bye-bye Super P – Hello IS-6

            • you won’t be making money with an is-6, you basically have to fire all gold all the time

            • my IS6 is the money earner in my garage, in comparrison to the SP its better armored and sadly, also faster… have both, but SP is a goner.

              also, lack of penetration hasnt stopped good players, it is currently the T8 heavy with best win ratio. IS6 is in my opinion the best T8 heavy.

            • IS-6 is better at close quarters, where penetration matters less. Higher alpha and lower RoF also means you have to aim shots way less often in order to achieve the same effective.

            • >Bye-bye Super P – Hello IS-6
              And you’ll have to give them around 20 euro for the difference, keikaku dori…

  2. Doesn’t appear to model or take into account the third thickness of armour plate above the MG port on the spaced armour.

    • the armor hitbox only takes into account the first plate for both armor and spaced armor, the secondary layer underneath is only cosmetic

      • There are 3 layers in the real vehicle. 2 are spaced and a much smaller piece cut and welded to the outside of the top layer which is above the MG port. That area is therefore a double thickness on the outside layer and then a second layer before the hull armour. It is shown in both the real vehicle and on the WoT visual model but does not seem to be reflected in the game armour model.
        Perhaps SS will post the images to clarify if needs be.

        • The devs are well aware of the construction details, AFAIK. The logic is simply that since the boiler plate the SuPer had on its nose had only about half the stopping power of proper armour steel of equivalent thickness, they might as well streamline the outer spaced model into one plate.

          • 40mm layers of boiler plate was used, now boiler plate is not as good as rolled steel, it’s much softer, but it would still help, espically 3 layers of it at 40mm each… that would slow a shell down quite a bit.

            most early tanks (so imagine tier 1 to 3 or so) used boiler plate quality like steel as their armor.

            • No. They may have been kind of primitive, but reasons why you should use hardened steel for protection were well known soon into the freaking Iron Age. Only prototypes and zero-series practice-run vehicles (generally later used for training) were made of soft steel.

            • Kellomies is right on this. The reason soft steel is used for training vehicles and prototypes is because it is easier to work with and it is cheaper to make.

        • You are correct the machine gun has 3 layers of 38mm armor around it, yet they only model 1 in armor model.

          Should be 38mm + 38mm spaced + 38mm spaced + 102mm hull around and above the machine gun. or considering they won’t model in the 2nd spaced layer and just buff the hull to try and represent it (I wish they would do it proper) 38mm Spaced + 178mm should be all around the machine gun.

          This image shows the 3rd layer around it, and the 2nd layer on the LFP we don’t get any extra armor for as well.

          • Actually now that I checked the armor model we do get the extra armor on the LFP. normally it’s 76mm on the LFP, but a small area is given 114 armor to represent the 2nd plate. still not sure if it extends the proper distance I can’t get a good angle to compare.

  3. This makes me wonder… since VOllketten and SerB both linked the same picture about the ears on the SP:
    1) Why are they not modeling the rear boiler plate and the machine gun plate?
    2) if the angle was oh-so-unhistorical and uberimportant to fix, how come that the complete lack of historical armor plates on the in-game model is not an issue at all?

        • Both questions have been answered numerous times. To expedite and simplify both programming and modeling, they used the effective armor.

          0.5 + 0.5 = 1
          Why is this so hard to understand?

          • Why is it so hard to understand my question?

            I’m talking about VISIBLE armor plates, namely an extra one over the MG port, and a square one on the rear of the tank (not on the front, on the rear). I’m not talking about calculations, I’m talking about actual graphical elements.

            • 1. It’s a weakspot-sized element.
              2. It’s not a weakspot

              Meaning, people will not be activly aiming towards it, the only protection it gives is a minor percentage of shots deflected from long range, extra armor node to add, not worth the hassle.

    • Well i think the double spaced armour is probably too difficult to model (zero computer programming knowledge so I may be wrong on that). Either way the SP frontal armour with ‘soft’ boiler plate would still have been very effective. Thanks to shape for posting that linked image to demonstrate what I meant.
      Regardin ghe ears I think people get confused because there are pictures of the PS without them either before they were welded on or just prior/during scrapping when they got cut off. Don’t think that ‘boiler plate’ is useless just because it is softer than ‘armour steel’, the issue s far more complex than that.

      • I should probably have mentioned that modern boiler plate (I dont think anyone other than Serb who states that the SP front spaced armour steel is is half the strength of ‘normal’ armoured steel) has a brinell scale hardness of about 400 to 500bhn and the same supplier who now supplies the US Army with armoured steels produces armour plate from 320 to 540 bhn max.

      • Its not really that difficult, its all in formulas, they have done the bulk of the programming in all the other tanks of the game, what they need to do here is just create a multiple step formula.

        Does it penetrate the first armor plate or does it bounce? (formula 1)
        *If it bounce no more calculations required.
        *If it penetrates does the space armor affect the bullet? Yes(HEAT ammo) then no damage
        ————————————————————————- No, how much penetration power does it lose? Result is inserted on formula 2
        Does it penetrate the second armor plate? (formula 2)
        No, no more calculation required, no damage done.
        Yes, How much penetration power does it lose? Result insert on formula 3
        Does it penetrate the hull? (Formula 3)
        No, no damage
        Yes, Roll damage generator number.

        See how easy is to program it, now what the programmers need to do its encode it on the programming language they are using for the game.

  4. Looks like the removed the turret weakspots, then added them back too, isnt that what the blue is?

  5. I don’t get it. If I shoot at the spaced armor over the red part, how much mm of penetration do I need to go through it? If I shoot the spaced over over the yellow part, how much mm of penetration do I need to go through it?

    • Don’t shoot the Tiger II mantle? Since when has that been smart in the first place?

    • To answer the question instead of mysteriously switching to a completely different tank:

      Jingles did some testing during the first test, if you want to have a look-see you can tack this onto the youtube URL: /EBCCLXRAeIs?t=14m40s

      To summarize his findings, dead-on the armor is woefully ineffective against 200mm average penetration, with shots going though both the thin upper and thick lower armor, low rolls aside. It’s effective enough to block about 25% of shots.

      Situation improves when angling the hull, but since the side armor is such crap, you can’t angle much more than AP normalization will negate. Definitely improves the armor, but only by another 25% or so.

      My own testing (by shooting at them in the Object 416) shows about the same results when shooting the hull, though I seem to have slightly better luck getting through the armor when it was angled than he did.

      Anyway, I guess this can be called an improvement; after all, you get more thick armor up front. But it’s still so easy to avoid…it’s not anywhere near a solution, it’s a very halfassed attempt at appeasing people who don’t want their already borderline mediocre tank nerfed into complete uselessness.

      At this point, it almost seems like Wargaming WANTS people to sell the tank. They know how to make it better – upgrading the goddamn gun would be a good start, to balance the reduction in armor effectiveness out – but for whatever reason they just won’t.

      • They obviously want people to sell it and buy some gold for the next cheapest T8 premium.
        It’s a shameless cash grab, I guess that’s why it was discussed so much.

        Also if people flock en masse to the JT88 (10k gold), which is too good of a monemaker, they will nerf the LFP to these new values, basically doing the same cash grab again, this time pushing for the tanks in the 12k gold range.

        • So you’re telling me that aside from the thicker edge armor, 200mm pen is enough to pen the front?

        • Providing a refund is not a cash grab. In fact, it’s pretty much the polar opposite.

          If they nerfed it without providing a refund, then you could call it a cash grab. As it is, it’s just Wargaming fixing a mistake (unhistorical uber armor) and trying not to piss off their customers.

          But no, apparently you won’t be satisfied until they provide you with a refund and also give you additional gold. Which is insane.

          • It’s not a refund. They’re just going to give you* the buy-value in gold.
            They’ve already made their money on the original purchase. They’re just giving you* the gold that you* bought originally.
            And seeing that most people will go to the next t8 prem, they’ll need to buy more gold.
            So in trading you* 7200 gold for the superpershing, they’re making more money (aka cash grab) by having you* buy the difference in gold for the next t8 premium.

            * You is used in a general term, not to identify Rognik specifically.

            • Total agree.
              It’s a GOLD refund, so if you just wanted the SP and nothing else, you’re pretty much fucked up. They will NOT refund your money, your bucks are gone even if they turned your tank into a bad joke. That would be an honest refund if they would give bak the money you spent.
              ATM they refund anything, you just have the possibility to respend your 7K2 gold not to get back your 27€ to buy a another video game.

              And now with 7K2 gold and otherT8 premium for “only” 11K a lot of ppl (sadly) will spend more money to reach the 11K and buy JT88, T-34-3, etc. And when the T23 will be ready, ppl who had SP would already spend their refund so to train their US med tank crew… same player pay again. With the nerf and the “refund” thay will make more money.
              Disgusting commercial behavior but nothing new.
              With those

  6. What other changes were made from test 1 to test 2? I saw that turret rotation and aiming should have been changed, but did they? to better or worse?

    • Only because you play against other premium tanks and super pershings on the test server… that will change as soon as they apply this to the main game… Still I admit it’s better on test 2 then test 1