Can the T-54 model 1949 “light variant” be a tier 8 Soviet premium?

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Hello everyone,

yesterday, I made a post about the light variant of the T-54 based on info Slakrrr from US forums found. I proposed this vehicle to become a tier 8 light tank in the post and the same question was asked by someone else too. Actually, a developer replied that WG is aware of this vehicle and is considering it.

Immediately after the article, speculations arose whether this tank can become Soviet tier 8 premium (possibly replacing somehow the ill-fated T-44-85). Let’s compare it a bit with other tier 8 premiums.

Now, we will be working with following premises:

- Type 59 as a premium tank is overpowered
- T-34-3 as a premium tank is fine
- T-44 as a regular tier 8 tank is fine

First, let’s compare it with the Type 59, to make sure it wouldn’t be OP immediately.

Armor

Upper frontal plate of Type 59 is 100mm thick at 60 degrees, T-54 (49) has 80mm at 60 degrees
Lower frontal plate of Type 59 is 100mm thick at 55 degrees, T-54 (49) has 80mm at 55 degrees
Turret front of Type 59 is 200mm, T-54 (49) has 180mm

In practically all the armor aspects, T-54 (49) is inferior. So far so good. T-44 has 90mm hull armor (under the same angle, eg. better), but it has weaker turret – significantly. But then, that is not that big a problem, since the T-54-3 also has that typical Chinese/Soviet round hardened turret (with 190mm frontal turret armor no less). I’d say armor-wise it fits.

Gun

Both tanks have the D-10T. Type 59 however has increased D-10T penetration (181). The D-10T itself for a premium tank IMHO is not a serious problem. The T-44 tier 8 regular Soviet tank has even a better 100mm gun, the LB-1. T-34-3 has that powerful 122mm gun, which fires every odd Sunday (if you’re lucky), but it works. With some tweaks here and there in soft stats, the D-10T could work.Remember that old T-34-3 render when it was first announced? It was with the D-10T gun (or its Chinese equivalent anyway), only later the developers apparently decided to replace it with the 122mm gun not to make another Type 59 clone. The soft stats of the D-10T are a problem a bit (it’s quite accurate), but keep in mind that this is a 1949 proposal and the weapon was not even stabilized yet as far as I remember, so – lightened vehicle means bumpier ride, which means worse accuracy on the move etc. Depression would be probably standard T-54 (-5 deg), which is again inferior to Type 59. Gun-wise, I think it could be balanced, yes.

Mobility

Well, here we might have a problem. The light version of T-54 is supposed to have a 520hp engine, 31 tons, 16,8 hp/t and 58,7km/h maximum speed. Type 59 in the game weighs 35,7 tons, but also has the 520hp engine (14,56 hp/t), giving it poorer mobility. T-44 in its LB-1 configuration has a 680hp engine and weighs 33,68 tons (20,19 hp/t). T-34-3 is strangely enough not worse than Type 59 – despite its sluggish feeling, it is actually lighter (35,2 tons) for the same 520 hp engine (14,76 hp/t). This is bad. The T-54 light version is clearly superior to both Chinese “T-54-like” premium mediums in mobility. It is inferior to the elite (LB-1) T-44 (T-44 however has worse terrain resistance), so theoretically it MIGHT count, but yes.

Conclusion

Inconclusive, but most likely “no”. It does lose some of its protection from dropping the armor, but the terrain passability and power-to-weight ratio gain is rather significant. Count in the same gun the Type 59 has and we might be actually looking and another somewhat overpowered premium tank. Of course, the mobility COULD be compensated by adding bad terrain resistance (which in turn would however make little sense, since the vehicle was designed to actually have better terrain passability than the regular T-54, or Type 59 for that matter), but… yea. Plus there is that tiny fact that it IS in fact a T-54 clone in literal sense of word, apart from the smaller roadwheels and different mantlet, it would look exactly the same, which is probably also something the developers don’t want to have.

As a tier 8 Soviet light tank, it theoretically might survive, as a light/medium tank hybrid (tier 8 WZ-132 has only 50-55mm of frontal armor (including turret), it has a superior gun and weighs only 24 tons for its 520hp engine), but on this level, you actually have a gun problem and the vehicle would definitely not be able to scout properly (the fact it is actually lighter doesn’t mean it was designed to scout historically, it was designed to participate in regular or special combat operations in soft terrain). So again, hard to say.

Third option would be to have the “light” hull as an optional hull for the T-54 (there are two option hulls for T-54 already: one with 120mm front armor, the other with 100mm), that would however have to mean the introduction of the third turret (the lighter version) for this to make any sense.

We’ll just have to see, but I very much doubt we will see the light T-54 as a tier 8 premium medium tank. What I think will happen is that the developers will draw some conclusions themselves from the introduction of the T-44-85 and will see what happens in 8.11, when it comes out.

40 thoughts on “Can the T-54 model 1949 “light variant” be a tier 8 Soviet premium?”

  1. “The soft stats of the D-10T are a problem a bit (it’s quite accurate), but keep in mind that this is a 1949 proposal and the weapon was not even stabilized yet as far as I remember, so – lightened vehicle means bumpier ride, which means worse accuracy on the move etc. ”

    Are you joking? The 100 mm D-10T has incredibly bad soft stats. It has worse accuracy than the Type 59′s gun.

    • Does it? Same aimtime (2,9s), same accuracy (0,39), Type 59 however has somewhat worse dispersion when moving turret, it has better depression though and the gun weighs a bit less. Remember this is a 1949 model, we are talking about the 1945 model of D-10T (T-54 stock gun), not the thing that’s sitting on SU-100 or whatever.

      • Oh, I was thinking of the D-10T used on the T-44, that one has 0.42 m accuracy, not 0.39 m. You are correct in that case.

        • 2.9 s aim time is pretty awful, though. And the WZ-132′s top 100 mm is still better in most aspects.

  2. What made the Type 59 so deadly was the combination of armor, firepower and speed. The armor was especially OP as the lower tiers couldn’t touch it.

    The light T-54 while having better HP/Ton ratio than the Type 59 it still looses in everything bar turret armor to the t-44. That is the logic of the premium tanks, better than same tier stock but worse than same tier elite tanks.

    I don’t think including it as an alternative hull to the ingame T-54 would works as it would have a different, other than intended, turret, track and gun.

    • “(…) The armor was especially OP as the lower tiers couldn’t touch it (…)”

      Yes… it WAS :)
      Personally, for me – Type 59 is still good premium tank. But its just a shadow of Type 59 from release day (i bought it in same day when WG introduced it – my brother did same). I still were noob, but when we played it in platoon, i was very impressed. It bounced so many shells, reload, firepower, accuracy was great. Impressive mobility. And the most important thing – it was flat. When i sticked to E75 or Maus, i was almost invincible.
      Today Type is still great premium, but its not OP. 1v1 battle against Type isnt such challenge anymore.
      2,9s of aimtime? It pains. But with good crew, its not so terrible. Im just used to this.

      T-54 as premium 8 tier med? Sure. Id glady buy it if WG introduce it. Another one fast earning tank, which can be fun while playing in wolf pack :))

      • It still is. If you’re being penetrated more it might be because of the premium ammo being sold for credits.

        The Type 59 is still very difficult to penetrate for most of the t6 and some t7 guns.

        A lot of t8 meds also have problems penetrating it frontally. When you compare it to the T-44 it is, arguably, a better package and it completely outclasses the T-34-2.

  5. Type59 and OP in one sentence? Please…. Put normal crew in and put the tank to hands of someone not having 1500 battles with it and you will see, how OP it is. I.e., not at all.

    If I can extrapolate from my and my friends’ experience, it’s at least 5 skill crew, more than 1000 battles in it, and can barely reach my total avg WR nowadays… The mobility has been lowered, cannon is bouncy as hell and it takes ages to aim properly. Just start selling it again and you will see it’s overall stats plunge.

    BTW, I rarely play it nowadays, I find Tiger H to be more fun while still earning a lot (no need to use premium ammo, which is necessary for type).

  6. Why does everyone share this stupid rumor ? Type 59 is not OP, its all about players. If a good player knows how to use its strong abilities, he can affect the battle and use them to win the battle. If a bad player plays with Type 59, he won’t do a shit despite using Type 59 and it does not matter what will he do. It is not OP and it makes me quite angry when I see people sharing this rumor because it makes people believe it is OP and they want it and if they put it back into gift shop my Type 59 will cry because of all these noobs who thinks that it is OP but apparently not in their hands so they won’t do a shit.

      • An earlier made point in this comment section sort of invalidates your argument, SS.
        Type 59 since very long time now is played by players having it for a very long time (cant remeber exactly when it went out of sale, must be ages). That means there are very few players with it that have no clue playing it, thus reducing the statistically significant influence of Type59-noobs.

        Regarding your link: since i can’t read russian i don’t know which player base is uses (2 years or all) so if it is all-time, all the former OPness (which was definitley there) influences this graph which leads to a higher curve than from statistical data with current type59 vehicle stats.

      • SS I am with you thst it is OP for a PREMIUM tank.
        However take into account that most type 59 players have had it for a long time. They have gotten used to it, have equipment and awesome crews. No influx of new players to disturb the stats…

      • Well, I guess these two guys said what I wanted to say. The last time the Type 59 was in giftshop was August 2012. I know it because I bought it that day. Now I have 485% crew (means 3x 100% skill and 85% of the 4th skill) with almost 1,3k battles and I think I am not the worst player with Type. As premium it is not OP, its stats are made by players who has this tank for long time so they propably knows how to play it. The only noobs we can talk about are the players who won the Type in these WG contests but I think this is quite small number.

        • Still its stats are also good. Tell me why does type 59 deserve to have easier MM than regular tier 8 tank?
          Is its gun weak? No its fine for medium, has enough penetration.
          Is its armor weak? Certainly not its better than many other tier 8 medium tanks?
          Is it slow? Compare to german tanks its still race car.
          If they dont want to change type 59 stats atleast give it normal tier 8 med tank MM.

          • The limited MM is probably the reason why it has such a low OP-point on the graph SS mentioned. Because if it was fighting against T10 on a regular basis the not-so-good-players with it would strongly pull the stats down, i think.

          • I would not mind fighting against X teirs. I already got medal for killing two X teirs in one battle but it is kinda hard to get such medals because I don’t play it so much and if I do we play with another limited premium tanks like FCM or KV-5. Anyways if the remove the MM cap it would be still good tank for me, just more profitable.

      • Most of that could be due to the reduced mm though. If it faced tier 10 one third of the time like regular tier 8 tanks it wouldn’t do so well.

    • T8 LTs already get into Battle-Tier 12 (which is the highest -> a T10-only match with some T8-scouts)

      There is no point in adding T9 LTs, unless you rebalance ALL light tanks (again).

  10. Hmm…why struggling to think for ways of how to add it as a t8 premium when it can be a fine tier 8 light/medium hybrid set as a bridge between the upcoming(yet unknown) LT branch and the t-54 branch?
    You know…as KV-13 is a bridge between the heavies and mediums(and vice-versa)

  11. Another tier 8 premium that doesn’t have anything distinctive? No thanks. Some nations like France, or Britain are really lacking in premium tanks, US has two lines of TDs and still no premium TD in sight, yet boring T-44/T-54 and IS clones keep appearing in the game.

  12. I think it would be a fine Tier8 prem tank. No armor, mediocre gun, but great speed and good camo.
    It should not need limited MM, but giving it pref MM is not a big problem.
    Unica maybe able to abuse camo/viewrange with this and utterly stomp pubs, but there is only so much carrying you can do with a mediocre gun that fires lackluster AP/APCR if you play vision game and snipe. Baddies as always are gonna be bad, seeing how they trashed FCM50t and scouts in general should give you some ideas.
    Overall, I think it will not be OP (not Type59 or SU-122-44 level of OP) and will cater to hardcore MT players.

  13. Lighter version of T-54 with wider tracks….

    Why not have it as a medium tier 9. Less weight and wider tracks = faster acceleration and better terrain resistance. An even lighter and faster (and softer) version of T-54.
    That way it could fit the players that want to battle in their light tanks, instead of the usual ‘scouting’. Not unlike how the Tertrak or Cromwell are used.

    In this tank I want to dance around like a Harlequin, flip-flopping between enemy shots, making them bleed credits every time they miss, and then disappear into the shadows like a Silent Stalker.

  14. First of all, Type59 is not OP. Check it from the press account:)
    Second – T-44-85 is not ill-fated and it’s planned for 8.11 release and it’s great (I have it, it’s a fun tank to play and one of the best T7 mediums if not THE best). Therefore, there’s no need for T-54-premium.

  15. On the possibility of it being a light tank, and not a medium, it would not be immediately comparable with same tier mediums, and especially not the Type 59 with it’s preferred MM. Light tank means light tank MM.