WG EU on Lags and Packet Loss

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Source: http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/360207-latency-and-packet-loss/

Hello everyone,

I don’t usually repost WG stuff “as is”, but this shouldn’t “disappear”, because it’s a nice explanation of what happened and happens even now. So, what do you think about this?

Dear Commanders!

The last couple of weekends have presented both you and us with some very high packet loss and latency issues while playing World of Tanks in the late afternoon and evening. In response to these problems, our engineers have been working around the clock and we have put in place several measures to increase the network performance at our end. We understand how disruptive these issues have been for your gameplay and we would like to apologise for the inconvenience caused to you!

We would like you to know more about the root causes we have identified and are currently addressing.

  • During our investigations into how to optimise our internal network performance, we identified a piece of network hardware that has been causing some degradation (packet loss) during times of high traffic throughput. This issue was isolated and fixed last week.
  • The second problem is unfortunately not fully under our control and it is also fairly technical. I apologise in advance if this description is a bit too technical, but we want to give you the full picture of the situation.
  • Internet traffic volumes in Europe have been elevated during the same time period that we have monitored latency issues for a large number of our players. Partially, this traffic increase is coming from an unusually high volume of streaming content due to the Olympic Winter Games. This volume increase is placing high demand on ISP peering exchange point capacities. Internet Service Providers (ISPs) have peering agreements and connection points between each other, outside of the major Internet backbones. Usually ISP-to-ISP peering helps reduce the load faced by the major backbones and accordingly provides a better flow of traffic between all parties. That being said, the capacities available for ISP peering are regulated both by agreements between the ISPs and physical limitations at the exchange points. If the demand exceeds the capacity, as it has several times in the last weeks for many of the major ISP peering points, the traffic must be rerouted via lower priority routes, which results in higher latency and packet loss. Cascading effects when several peering capacities are simultaneously exceeded across different ISPs are making this issue a very tough problem to solve for the ISPs.

We have been and are continuing to work very closely together with our ISP to address capacity shortages on these peering agreements during peak times. Since these negotiations are taking place between the ISPs, we are able to exert our influence, but we cannot directly resolve the problem.

  • Thirdly and unfortunately again outside of our control, the European network infrastructure had to cope with the largest DDoS (Distributed Denial of Service) attack in history last week, reaching more than 400 Gigabit/s of additional malicious traffic. This caused a severe overload on Internet backbones in Frankfurt, Amsterdam and London as well as additional stress on the peering capacities between providers.

Our promise: Going forward we will be continuing to monitor our internal network and server performance and will swiftly take action on everything that we can directly affect. We will also continue to monitor the overall network traffic conditions and work with our partners to find better alternative routing solutions and increase peering capacities. Additionally, we will increase our level of communication on all the issues we are detecting in our internal networks, as well as any impairments we observe on the major Internet routes to our data centres, so that you are aware of what is going on.

What we cannot promise: While we are confident that our actions to address these problems will help to reduce the severity of the issues, unfortunately at this time we are not yet able to say that you won’t experience additional latency and packet loss issues during peak times. We are hopeful that the ISPs in Europe will address their peering capacity shortages swiftly and that we can give you the “all clear” very soon.

Yours sincerely,
Markus Schill
Director of Customer Relations Europe

126 thoughts on “WG EU on Lags and Packet Loss”

    • WGNA is still taking the attitude of “it’s all on your end, nothing to see here MOVE ALONG CITIZEN”.

      • It’s interesting how USA collapses from a Democracy to Corporationist Police State AND most of Murricans tend to be okay with this *sigh*

        • USA was never a Democracy, its been Imperialistic since its founding days and now its Fascist.

          How the hell can you call a Two Party Representational “Democracy” For a Democracy at all? Its just a popularity test between two parties. Also its spying on its own people, Corporations have always had corrupt power in the government, USA silences anyone who dare to speak public about their dirty history and what they are currently doing.

          Bombing countries for a very long time even today with drones.

          Democracy? Do not make me laugh

          • Uh, just FYI but the de facto two-party system is the direct, well-known and natural result of the “First Past the Post” voting method. Same thing in the UK. Go whine at the people who thought that was a good idea way back when the whole thing was set up.

            And name me one state that HASN’T spied on its citizenry for any number of reasons, internal security being the self-evident universal default one.

          • Quick question:

            What country DOESN’T spy on its own people? Pretty much every country that can, will, and we only know about it in the US because of a combination of incompetence of some government employees and the sheer number of whistle-blowers over here. Even if some people are silenced, there’s simply too many to be ‘silenced’ entirely, and information spreads too quickly to control it, whether the information is true or not (people will believe what they want to believe; I’m not saying what the government says is always true though, because the fact of the matter is that anonymity makes lying much easier for anyone who uses the internet).

            The theory of Realpolitik exists for a reason: the US does it because most other countries either also do it themselves (you can’t honestly tell me with a straight face that nations in Europe don’t spy on their own people, even today), or would if given the capability.

        • I don’t have the patience to address in a debate all the things wrong with this comment chain, so I’ll just say several things:
          1. Obama says that you’re welcome
          2. The USA has never been a democracy, it has been since its inception, a republican state.
          3. ExoNut obviously either does not live in America or lives in Appalachia.
          4. Tenno SMGJohn is an idiot or just perhaps incredibly poorly educated.
          5. Kellomies is right
          6. Tenno SMGJohn has the mental maturity of a 12 year old.

      • I was always a supporter of the game, a premium player, gold rounds when needed, prem garage, bundles, etc. Since 8.9 my lag problems have got to the point where I cant play sometimes, 3-10 fps. I have not spent one penny since then. I have spent at least $1800.00 since joining on 10/2011. I will not spend my hard earned money ever again until WGNA fixes this. When I first joined I was good to go, avg 20-30 fps, until the 8.9 update. 8.11 is unplayable for me atm,. Balls in your court WGNA, get a move on this or I’m sure thousands of players will eventually stop spending. Brain” working as intended”, is yours? Time to boycott WOT by not purchasing anything.

      • I know, right? Yeah, it’s pretty much a given that the holder of executive power in any country will inevitably become a scapegoat, it’s just more noticeable in the US because of its prominence in global politics.

    • 1. All traffic passes through NSA/GCHQ.
      2. The rate of growth in data transfer is higher than surveillance storage capacity.
      3. Traffic is micro-delayed as it queues to be stored, this ‘hidden latency’ will increase in the short term until extra capacity is opened in Utah. The cycle will then repeat.
      4. There is no way this surveillance will stop, they would rather down the net entirely.

      The answer? Revolution.

      • Correct.

        Also, the US has never been a Democracy – it is a “Constitutionally limited representative democratic republic”.

        Before you post ignorance, understand reality.

        • “Also, the US has never been a Democracy – it is a “Constitutionally limited representative democratic republic”.”
          ._________.
          Sure is a big fucking difference.

            • I think you mean both Communism and Socialism are (or claim to be) Marxist…

              Anyways, my point is rather that particularly Muricans seem to have an annoying tendency to use “Democracy” as a hollow buzzword slogan just like “freedom”, without specifying – or even thinking about – what they actually *mean* by the term.

              Sers, what IS supposed to the the practical difference between “Democracy” and “Republic” in the context of modern societies…?

              • “Sers, what IS supposed to the the practical difference between “Democracy” and “Republic” in the context of modern societies…?”

                Hard to say, really. A republic literally means a state without a heritidary head of state, but it does not tell you anything beyond that. Which is probably why it is called a democratic republic. That means it is a state without a emperor, king, prince, duke or whatever, where the guys in charge get elected. Anybody describing the USA as anything but a democracy needs to have his head examined. The common misconception is that democracy equals fair government. It doesn’t. All it says that citizens get a chance to vote on who gets to screw them over for a certain period of time.

                • Well, do not get too technical on description of democracy. Ever heard of socialistic democratic republic? We had only one option to vote for and in case there were multiple choices in some elections, it was more of like “who would you like to be a mascot of the party”. Hard to say elections were riggged in a way that there were false votes as if none came to vote, since you kind of had to go to vote and you had to vote for that one party, else you would get into troubles and you would make yourself visible in the eyes of state (you could be marked as politicaly uncomfortable, you could have problems getting into school, getting into job, traveling, your relatives could get into troubles, you could get problems with a place to live, etc etc) If I remember correctly, Aristoteles described democracy as selfish rule of majority. The legal description on democracy is little longer and little more complex, but you kind of got the point. It can be either direct or indirect wih imperative mandate or forbidding of imperative mandate etc etc, its can get quite long. The description you gave on republic is more or less right too IIRC. But, if you really want to get technical and if you will wait till monday, I will give you an exact definitions on both terms, but is it really that necessary? It should be rather established whenever all of you when you talk about democracy and republic mean it as a legal term of state law or you talk about it in line of philosophy, which also deals with these terms. Like you got justice in terms of de lege lata and de lege ferenda, so when you want to talk about law being just, you have to establish what do you mean and understand under it. But if they are getting into philosophical matter of democracy and you get into legal matters, then it is kind of like apples and oranges. You both talk about fruits yet you talk about different things.

                  I myself wont say whenever I consider USA to be democratic (neither in terms of philosophy nor law) since I do not live there, these talks should be mostly restricted to those who actually live there or are some sort of concerend in it, eithers studying it working in international relations etc. Else this all is just a theroetical discussion of “what if it is like this or that in there”, based on limited knowledge either from news or some articles.

                  I only think that restricting everything down to exact legal terms can have and always had terrible, terrible results. The worst case was with nazi germany, where their establishment and their unhuman laws were according to their contemporary law fine. I DO NOT COMPARE USA WITH WWII GERMANY, it was just mere note taken from history of law. It was one of the reasons The Universal Declaration of Human Rights and many other treaties came to be. So do you really want to talk if one or another state is “democratic”/”free” in either way only based on fact if it falls into legal description?

            • Communism is Marxism in reality. The answer why can be found in evolution theory and theory of games.

              • Yep. Great in theory, terrible in practice.

                Hell, it’s a little-known fact but Marx once said “The one thing I know is that I am not a Marxist.”

                He didn’t even take his own theory seriously!

                • @ martin: I studied law and I am a student of history, it is kind of you to offer the exact technical descriptions, but I got any number of books on this, frankly boring, subject right behind me. :-) I know a hell of a lot about Russia and eastern Europe as those are my main specializations. I know what you are referring to, but I do not agree with your line of argument. First, actually being somewhere does not necessarily equal a better perspective. in fact, being part of something means you are more likely to be biased. Second, for a vote to be meaningful, there has to be a choice. Most theory on state forms are at pains to point out that a democracy requires a real vote, as opposed to the old communist sham votes.

                • I believe the quote goes something along the lines of “if *that* is Marxism then I am not Marx” or thereabouts, actually. I gather the context was one of the endless arguments about theory and policy he had in the First International with Kropotkin, Bakunin and whoever.

              • “Marxism” in what sense exactly?

                Anyways, AFAIK at some point Soviet theoreticians began describing the state as “Really Existing Socialism”, which is a curiously evasive if not outright shamefaced concept. The reality falling distinctly short of the theory was kind of too blatant to ignore, which for that matter had its part in the eventual collapse of the state.

                Well, it’s not like any radially utopian political movement ever had been anything else than a signal failure anyway. Revolutionary Communism is merely the latest in a very long line indeed.

            • Communism is not Socialism, Communism is Communism and Marxism is one of many forms of Socialism.

              Like Market Socialism which is ridicules like Collective Capitalism.

        • Its a constitutional republic, constitution says so, and by the way democracy doesn’t even figure in the constitution.
          China and Cuba are democracies (their constitutions says so..)

        • While I am Canadian, we aren’t too far different than our neighbors south of the border, ‘cept for a clear superiority in hockey and beer. So, I think I’m at least 1% qualified to speak about the system I’ve spent my life in… And just putting it out there, it ain’t that bad. Like most North Americans, I lead a safe, comfortable, well cared for life. I can speak freely without worry of a secret police visit. I don’t worry about if this a good place to raise my kids. And I can make fun of Putin, Obama, the bush family, the queen of England, and colonel sanders all day long. Is the place perfect? No. Is it even smart? Sometimes, hell no. The problems of criminality, inequity and injustice are not fully solved, and won’t be in my lifetime. Is it good enough that I feel lucky to be here? Absolutely. At no point in history has a generation had it this safe, secure and steady. Has this been acheived 100% cleanly? No, ask any Arab, Vietnamese, Korean, Angolan, etc., they’ll tell you all you need to know. That said, it is, at its heart, a fundamentally benign system that has acheived much for its populace, more so than any that preceded it, and I do feel lucky to be here, if recognizing of past and current errors and transgressions (for which justice must be served if the system is to work sustainably)

          In short, if you got better ideas, I’m all ears, but history and current state are tougher to beat than you think.

          • Will said my Canadian friend. I live in a third world country where things you have in Canada can only be dreamed of, and only by those who have enough exposure to dream of such stuff. Most people in a third world country can’t even imagine that such things are even possible in a state.

          • This was so far the most objective and the best comment in this discussion :) It all should be judged from the actual life and not theory like most people prefer to look upon.

  4. Relocating EU1 to the same place as EU2 and thus taking away the possibility for the players to choose from two different routes to the servers didn’t help either.
    And personally I had bad latencies to EU2 especially around 6pm to 8pm CET since long before the olympic wintergames…

      • No, to Amsterdam.
        Silenstalker mentioned that i could be possibly linked to the Munich incident, but as this operation normally takes several days, it should have been planned earlier for an unknown reason.
        Whatever, i think that having both servers at the same place increases the risk of issues.

        • trace 185.12.240.100 or better -> login.p1.worldoftanks.eu ( p1 = EU1 , p2 for EU2 )

          Server EU1 is eu4-slave and EU2 is eu3-slave.

          Connection is redirected from Amsterdam to Austria.

            • Its Amsterdam…

              If you get Austria as final then you need to start worrying about your PC having some dodgy proxy on it…

              And when they were is seperate cities, I could swap from one to the other for afternoon or evening playing to get a better ping.. now between 6-7pm I get fucked over on both by some shitty exchange in shitty london shitty town…

              shitty..!!

  5. So basically, there will not be any conpensation for the packet losses.. Like even the premium day that we got on Valentine’s day mission which alot of players couldn’t use because of the LAG?

    Lol, all I read in this article was WG bullcrap.

  7. Well, if I was the WG boss this guy would be immediately fired.

    So, after such a nice explanation the Director of Costumer Relations Europe does not have goodies to offer the players for their huge inconveniences?!?!?

    A lot of people lost Premium account days, lost battles where they used consumables etc.

    Is that hard to offer 2 or 3 Premium days and a few consumables?

    Explaining is only half of his duty, the other half is coming up with some kind of compensation for his costumers.

    Poor performance.

  8. Once again a wrong statement regarding the Internet backbones. Frankfurt currently has a reserve of 4 Terrabits/sec, so a 400 Gigabits/sec DDOS just used 10% of the reserve capacity….nothing that would influence the backbones speed.

    • On it’s own… We are talking about a major sporting event happening the same time that many people are streaming in HD just after House of Cards went live on Netflix while just about every streaming provider is announcing continuing growth. AND the biggest DDoS that Europe has seen, not to mention one of the first purely malicious attacks on a continent wide scale… Should we talk about flooding and the reduced number of functioning low priority routes as well?

      Congratulations for an amazingly poor sweeping statement…

      • Pkpsycho….none of the other online games is experiencing those problems….so just from the pure propability its 500 (wg messed up) to 1 (backbones messed up). Especially as the Winter Games transmission from Sotchi to the backbones and proxies is done per satellite, not cable.

  9. Anyway, this is the typical german company approach: “You are very lucky to have the game to play so do not complain too much…”

    I live in Germany and I know what I am talking about. And yes, Markus Schill is german.

    His post looks like Deutsche Telekom costumer letters…ahahah.

    He completely missed the last paragraph:

    “What we are going to do to compensate you – WG will be offering 3 days premium to all EU accounts and 10 fire extinguishers/10 first aid kits/10 repair kits. Enjoy all and good luck on the battlefield.”

      • Did you suddenly start getting money from WG? What he described is simply Good PR, and if they had any brains they would jump at the chance to do something like that… But, no, they are simply too greedy, or more likely just don’t give a shit for Eu players. If this happened in Russia, they would be showering their playerbase with gifts right now :)

  11. …and what of the NA packet loss issues with Telia?

    You know… constant 2-year old problem that is still mentioned day in and day out but overlooked? You’d think by now with the number of ping plots (enough to print out, tape together, and gift-wrap the new One World Trade Center) that they could present this to Telia and threaten to break contract for “inability to provide quality service.” It’s been at least *2* years …. if they brought this up to Telia… even under contract they have to give them time to solve the problems before a contract breach can be made. I think 2 years would have been more than sufficient time to try to fix it – which obviously they haven’t.

    • Yah, it’s really frustrating that players are reduced to having to run diagnostics programs to prove that there are serious, unresolved issues with Telia and for WG NA to ignore them completely. At least the EU community got their concerns addressed, all we get is denial after denial.

  12. I for one liked that they gave a pretty straight-forward and in-depth explanation. This guy clearly isn’t the guy who gives rewards and compensations and I would still think they might give us some. This guy is just trying to be clear about the issues. Usually it’s all vague talk and “everything will be fine, please keep buying gold” but this time they actually seem to have looked at the problem. Improvement, I’d say.

    • They must have been looking into that problem for some time, this was most likely not done in one day. But thanks to their awesome public relations capabilities and bashing players for having cheap ISP, instead of normal answers like – we are looking at it, we are investigating multiple possibilities of this cause or even make some more in depth answer like this one – they kept “insulting” players that they are blaming WG and others while the problem is between their chair and keyboard. As I see it, WG is too young to be such a huge, world wide company and either it will take quite a long time before they learn all the stuff from their faults (which will make players suffer each time) or they hire more people who have experiences in this fields.

      • Would you mind quoting the sentences that gave you those impressions from the above post? Especially the bit where they bash players, I just want to make sure you can in fact read…

        • First clear your yard and then try to insult others for theirs since you clearly have problems in the matter of reading as it seems. I said in my post: “(…) instead of normal answers like – we are looking at it (…) or even make some more in depth answer like this one (…)”
          Therefor it is clear I would be satisfied with even short answer and this one is even better.

          Anyway, I will answer your question nevertheless. Their statements were posted on some Q&As and maybe also in some other posts, here is an example from yesterday, which is not that rude, but as it was only day before this post, they at least could have been more open to the possibility the problems are on “their” side, since it affects so many people in the same time. Q&A 20.2.2014:
          Q: “Should we await fixes of the WoT lags?” A: “As much as necessery” (SS: SerB later states that lags are generally caused not by insufficiency of WoT servers, but by ISP’s – he advises you take the Pingplotter software and communicate with your ISP to fix the issue)

          It took me only few seconds to find this one. Also note the ” ” when I mentioned insulting, it means that word between them is not supposed to be taken literally.

          I only asked for proper answers and to take proper position from their side when any and all global problem arises in WoT.

          I understand it is much easier for people to start insulting than to re-read post to make sure you understood it or to do your own research on the subject of some comment but this is starting to look like playing chess with a pidgeon – no matter how well you play, the bird will knock down all figures, shit on the table and act as it won. I hope I quoted that meme right :)

            • Of course SerB =/= WG EU. Funny how you think that is clever. SerB is just known to give more or less informed answers and of course it is in an essentially informal context. Except if you meet the “trolling” that he often use in his comments in real life formal situations which I can not imagine in where I live.

              Captain obvious.

              • So much fucking woosh.

                The Point, finding which you might want to work on, was that whatever the Hell SerB says to his RU server audience, or doesn’t, informally in his Q&A’s has Jack Shit to do with what WG EU spokesman puts out in an official capacity.
                Get it now?

          • Do you realise you have in fact contradicted your first post by providing the original quotes? I had in fact suspected that this may be the source material you had mangled and I am happy to stand by my statement that I would like to check you can read. If you would like side by side comparison, I am happy to oblige:

            Q: “Should we await fixes of the WoT lags?” A: “As much as necessery” (SS: SerB later states that lags are generally caused not by insufficiency of WoT servers, but by ISP’s – he advises you take the Pingplotter software and communicate with your ISP to fix the issue)

            The above paragraph appeared to translate to -

            bashing players for having cheap ISP

            You could have easily said “asking players to check with their ISPs individually since long experience with telecoms companies has proven that volume of cases not size of the customer is the driving force to motivate ISPs to conduct network structure and management troubleshooting” Especially as SerB stated players should wait for a fix to the lag issues. Implying an ongoing investigation with no details available. This would have been an accurate distillation of the source material.

            Hopefully this will clear up any questions you have…

            • In short:

              The issue I put in my first comment: I am not satisfied with their PR, I would appreciate if their communication towards customers was better.

              Your response: You can not read.

              My response: In this case I find unpleasant that it took them few weeks to give prompt response.

              Your response: You are satisfied with their PR because you used wrong words.

              Are you serious? Will you keep running around and catching me word by word? I appologize that my native language is not English, I appologize that it is quite a few years since I used English in formal way and that forums are the last place where I still use English. I thought by my second post I would make clear what I meant. I am sorry that using “” in “insulting” was not enough to understand that I do not mean they are rude and I am sorry that explaining in my second post that I did not mean they are rude did not make it clear I do not mean they were rude. Is it ok now? Man I wrote that first comment just as a statement that they could do better in PR and you turned this to one of the most annoying things I dealt in the last week.

  13. It would help a lot if they did reduce the amount of data needed to be streamed. But that would mean giving more duties to clients to deal with, which would make their precious codes more vulnerable to exploit and – what is a really bad thing – would allow cheating. But this way, 3 times being disconnected during CWs in row (often whole teams, ours and even opponents) and reaching 300ms quite often is just nonsense. WG wants to expand all the time but is never prepared for it. Just remember when there was only one EU cluster. Luckily I got BF4 where I rarely exceed 70ms. If every producer made an excuse like it is because of olympics or ice hockey or anything else where would we be. Of course these things will make a strain on systems but they should already know about it and be prepared at least to some extent for these scenarios. Not hoping players would not mind being unable to play for weeks. And those who have paid premium for this time in advance – I feel so sorry for them, I really do. WG will simply do nothing to reimbruise them, at top would give them one to 3 days of premium, maybe 7 days premium if this issue will last another month.

    • This is a very pessimistic and simplistic view on things with very little understanding of business… I think the fact that we have this post to comment on is proof that it isn’t the usual WG Fail. I hate posting the same comment repeatedly but has anyone seen Netflix’s statistics for House of Card viewings over the weekend? They had to employ extra engineers for when it went live the volume was so high. We can’t point the finger at any one issue here, look at the weather and the damage it has done to infrastructures just in the UK. That will be causing the packets to be taking longer routes, saturating low priority nodes. Then we have the Winter Olympics… You say WG should anticipate this but surely it is the ISPs that should be recognising the exponential increase in streaming as a primary source for this kind of media and preparing for it? Not to mention the DDoS attack.

      By the way, it would be an extremely bad idea to start handing out compensation before the issue is resolved because they could not gauge yet what would adequate compensation for an ongoing issue! If they give everyone a day of premium and the issue continues they will have to give another day of premium. And another. And another. Whereas, waiting for the issue to be resolved, looking at the statistics from server logs and estimating the average loss experienced by the customer +5% for goodwill is actually good commercial practice.

      EDIT: Plus if WG agreements with their ISPs are anything similar to the Enterprise level BT contracts in the UK, once the issue is resolved the ISP may well owe WG money for disruption of business critical services. Which will be used to recompense players. FYI BT has guarantee of service contracts for hosting companies which pay £25000 for every half hour of downtime. I can imagine a similar deal being made for a game that is only playable online with this level of traffic!

      One point I will agree with (from an above comment) is that moving both servers to the same city was a bad move because it minimises the permutations necessary to spread the packet load.

      • I agree that same compensation for all players would be a bad thing, but imagine you are the one who paid for a month of premium, you could play only in the peak times and now because of these issues you (in this scenario) literally lost whole month of premium. There should be some sorf of compensation that would correspond to the loss. When the last time similiar thing happened (yet in much smaller scale, affected less players and was shorter), they gave one day of premium. That was perhaps more than enough for regular players but most likely as a slap for premium players, official forums were filled with complaints at that time. About compensating only after the issue is solved – that is sure thing, it would be madness to do it not for multiple reasons. But letting players know there will be some sort of compensation would be nice PR move. As I mentioned in my previous post – they have space for improvement in their PR department.

        Yes, I also agree that WG can not ensure ISP wont screw things up, but they should have been some sort of prepared for the possibility of ISP failure. Having both servers at the same location is – from the point of business – a nonsense. In here companies have to have some sort of backup on a different, quite distant and safe place, it is required from them by their contracts. Of course they are only temporary solutions but they serve so that services will not fail like they did during this. What if something severe happened to that ISP? Would whole EU lose everything? Or will whole EU be unable to play for two months till everything is set up again? Players would not care so much, if ISP paid 50mil € to WG for that. And if WG gave away too much gold / premium time to players, then it would screw up WoT economy, so either way it would be lose-lose scenario for both players and WG. WG should have some sort of backup for example in placing both clusters in different places. If one fails, there is still possibility for most players to play at the same time.

        You answered and agreed with me WG should have never placed EU1 and EU2 in the same location and this is solely WGs fault. They should have anticipated that if one location fails their whole service fails. This is what I meant by WGs fault. I understand it may have been hard to find ISP with sufficient capabilities as WoT is too much demaning game connection-wise compared to other games, but going for the easiest and cheapest one – extending already existing contract – has its own risks. And now, the risks turned real.

            • I understand it may have been hard to find ISP with sufficient capabilities as WoT is too much demaning game connection-wise compared to other games, but going for the easiest and cheapest one – extending already existing contract – has its own risks.

              • Well, the only real statement I did there about their ISP is that putting EU2 in hands of the ISP where the first one (i.e. EU1) is located would be cheaper. It is cheaper as of legal counseling and negotiations between both contracting parties to extend scale of current contract than to make a new deal and seal a contract with another provider. Therefor, it is the cheapest and easiest solution and probably also the fastest. It is even possible it was cheaper in long term too, as it is not that uncommon that extending one contract is cheaper compared to making additional one, since there could be some base cost and then additional cost, where with extended contract the base cost would stay untouched and only the additional cost would be added, but this last thing depends solely on their contract, so I can hardly say if it is also the cheapest one in long term.

                Edit: I hope it is not neccessary to describe what legal counseling means :) I hope it is clear that legal counseling does not mean “yes dude, do it/do not do it, its a bargain” :) :)

  14. Wait a minute……..

    WG is giving an explanation and acknowledging there was a problem :O. What happened? Are they drunk from drinking away their sorrows of all the lost gold medals?

  17. I am writing a report about the packet loss and lag on KR server, which didn’t get DDoS, good infrastructure, high latency between nodes and never get fully charged server for better observation about the lag in the good environment. Obviously, with generally minimum 2 ms of pin ,maximum 24 ms ping and average 10 ms ping (ofc literally 0% of packet loos with ping plotter observation) of players are having several packet loss during a match ( even more, the arty shell’s explosion in mid-air bug re-appear like 7 times of 10 fires).

    do you want me to finish this report and send you ?

    • because the same patch is applied to every server with localization no?
      so if it gives a lag or packet loss after 8.11 patch in the good environment, what else gonna be the problem?

  18. Never had any problem with packet losses, high pings, lags…. guess I live in the right spot then? 75 miles away from the A’dam servers? Though that should not be such an advantage me thinks?

  19. Did somebody mention lags/packet loss on NA server, I have played several games in the past few days and haven’t noticed anything. I’ve been seeing ~100 ping with no lag all week…

  20. Solutions:
    Put up 2 new servers in europe, one up in northern europe (for example Stockholm, Sweden) and one down in southern europe (for example Paris, France).
    Result:
    Less people on the same server during peak times, more choises when it comes to servers, so that people can play at some server that is good for their latency. Northern europe (Finland, Sweden, Norway and Denmark) have pretty great infrastructure, and would have no problem all playing on a server located in Stockholm since it would never be cloged up.

      • 1.) Middle of europe is 53°34′01.5″N and paris is at around 48°N (I think that that means that it is in the southern half of europe, doesnt it?)

        2.) I know that France is not in the MOST southern part of europe, but it does have one of its borders towards the mediterranean sea with africa on the other side.
        I would call all the countries that does part of southern europe (spain, italy, greece, portugal and so on), southern countries in europe.

        3.) I also know that Paris is not in the southern part of france, but when you look at network connections the geographical location is not all that counts. Someone in spain for example might get a better connection to partis then to some southern city in france (Since the routing will probably pass paris anyway).

        For spain, france italy and so on (collectively), the best place to have a server would probably be Paris. (If you think about the network in europe)

        • Paris is situated in what is conventionally termed *Western* Europe, sometimes more narrowly even “Northwestern”. Just FYI. “Southern” is normally understood to refer more or less to the Mediterranean region.
          Also in scientific literature.

          • Well that does not change the fact that it is in the southern half of europe.
            I was not talking about east/west here.

              • What is irrelevant to the topic is the definition of what is what in europe.
                This is about the networks and nothing else.
                When I said northern and southern europe, I basically cut it in half, and didnt talk about west/east. The server south would be for the people south (Spain, italy and france. If you think that the majority of those countries are something else then south, then its up to you.
                If something is south of something that is north, I will continue to call the locations in the south for southern locations and the locations in the north for northern locations.

                • …and what the Hell does the latitude of the geograhical midpoint supposedly have to do with network logistics? Your suggestion to use that as the division line makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

                  And your definitions of “northern” and “southern” Europe are still fucking retarded and totally detached from generally accepted and understood terminology. Don’t try to push your own arbitrary and solipsistic bullshit on others please.

                  For the record I live in Finland which makes the vast majority of human habitation subjectively “south” for me, but I don’t try to pretend that has any significance.

  22. Can we have a moment of silence for me and my fellow Indonesians who are still waiting for WG presence whilst playing under considerable lag under this stormy weather.

    *insert moment of silence*

    You may now comment about our shitty internet.

    • It is not about having a constant 250ms ping (or whatever you have), it is about having 25ms of ping, then suddenly its packetlosses all over and the tanks start teleporting around when you least expect it.. (And yes I mean teleporting around for real)

  23. Well, this looks more or less like a lie.

    Many people posted changes in routing during last days. Even my routing changed and I have currently direct routing from UPC server to Telia and WG server. So last two weeks they were solving routing problems caused by movement of the server. This was also confirmed by this answer

    http://forum.worldoftanks.eu/index.php?/topic/356472-aktualni-potize-se-servery/page__st__520__pid__7354308#entry7354308

    In the answer the support directly says they are making changes in routing between providers and their servers. Well, who chooses Telia as his provider will have problems.

    Hardware problems? Perhaps. But latency is one thing, the microlags the other. They are there since 8.9 and I think there is either server capacity problem or in-game problem.

    The stuff about streams and DDOS attacks is nonsense. WoWp has 30ms latency and no microlags.

  24. wow, much faggotry…many trolling…stronk debate…

    I like to think I’m a very reasonable person. Since I lack the ability to respond emotionally to stimulus from my environment, what do you think is the impetus for my desire to club some of these dickhead commentators over the head with a length of pipe and feed their bodies into an industrial-grade woodchipper, streaming their remains into a fish farm pond to be devoured by barramundi?

    Come visit me or stop giving me cancer, bitches.

  25. Yeah, because of the Olympic Winter Games there’s soooo much internet traffic. Yeah right. Next thing they tell us is “there was high ping because of Twitch Plays Pokemon” #trollserb

  26. Is there an online gaming service provider that respects their customers as if their existence relies upon continued patronage? I feel like I am lining up for cabbage with my ration card every time I purchase premium.

  27. They just closed the thread on the forums – wonder if they got tired of the whining..