25.3.2014

You might have noticed comments were disabled for a while – a small mistake on our part. It’s working now.

- in the game, gravity factor for all the tanks is the same
- implementing respawning is not “copying War Thunder”, according to Storm – garage battles were discussed by the time War Thunder was not out yet
- special “historical” characteristics (SS: mentioned in the earlier post today by Storm) will not apply for random battles, vehicles will not be balanced with historical battles in mind, because “it’s not needed”
- upcoming Kharkov map was never intended exclusively for historical battles
- historical battles themsleves took roughly a month of work, including the tests
- developers are still waiting for programmers to finish working on the new visibility mechanism, so it’s possible to increase the amount of spotting cycles (spotchecks)
- having more than 30 tanks in a battle still creates network issues
- pre-set setups for historical battles (SS: as in, Germans having for example 1 Tiger and 4 Panzers every time) create endless queues
- according to Storm, having several “realism” modes of random battles á la War Thunder is not viable. He states that in War Thunder, the first mode is played by 95 percent people, the second 3,5 percent and the third the rest, so the two other modes are pointless
- the player peak for WoT (and other online games) is December/January, that’s when most players play
- French tanks in 9.0 have graphic issues with tracks – they are too dark
- there is currently no need to buff artillery, their amount in battle is okay
- developers are wondering how to increase HE rounds usefulness, but haven’t thought of anything yet
- Storm hasn’t asked yet, how T-34 and KV will be balanced in 1941

78 thoughts on “25.3.2014

    • I also have an excelent idea to solve this… just havent thought it through yet XD

      • HE/arty question is a bit out of context.
        “- developers are wondering how to increase HE rounds usefulness, but haven’t thought of anything yet”
        anything yet that wouldn’t buff artillery => there is currently no need to buff artillery, their amount in battle is okay

  1. - developers are wondering how to increase HE rounds usefulness, but haven’t thought of anything yet

    And as long as arty remains in the game, they will never come up with a solution, unless they make HE shells work differently for arty and tanks….or remove arty altogether, which would be great.

    • And in the same time say “F*ck you” to everyone who spent time researching arty.. Yes, great idea…

      • If you went coward mode you have to pay a price, mate. Let’s see the ammount of butthurt clicker’s spam while they are waiting for their reload with the game minimized.

        • I think heavy tanks is more coward mode then arty. Or camping TDs. In arty you know soon as you’re spotted you die. Something a campy little JadgTiger or “sniping” IS-3 doesn’t have to worry about.

          • You only have to see the arty jumping into water and drowning themselves to see what cowards arty are.

              • If they consider the game is lost and is not worth their time they should simply left the battle letting the enemy know their position.Killing yourself so that the enemy can’t get the kill is stupid and not fair.

                • Although I prefer fighting to the last moment (since one well placed shot in GW Tiger P can do dmg of around 800-2000HP, I find hard to be mad at those who chose drowning. You see, arty is problably the most dependant vehicle of all in the game. It can not hold flank, it can not cover all of map, it can hardly track fast moving targets, especially with long flying shells over large distance. You know what is the arty best for? For smoking out those cowards that hide all the battle behind some rock. Or to scare off pushing heavies. Probably nothing frightens players than seeing T44 or Panther II oneshot or seeing KV4 or IS3 lose around 800-900HP in one shot :) Then they retreat and the day is saved… for one minute perhaps. And playing arty while minimilized window… no (at least average) arty player would do that. You have to constantly track targets, as for example when I am in said GW Tiger, reload takes around 45 seconds (IIRC?) and when hitting 20seconds of reload, I have to be already locked on another target, else I would be aiming even after having reloaded. Turning of GW Tiger P to target takes around 10 seconds, so you really have around 10-15 seconds to find target you know will be there when you are reloaded, a target, which if you hit will help your team. If arty goes for the easiest targets and hits some low tiers at the corner of map doing nothing, then that artys team is more likely to lose and therefor that arty player will have worse stats and worse winratio.

                  And now imagine when you are in arty and all of your team go nuts, half drowns or crashes, one teamkills and the rest dies in 2 minutes. There you are, in your S51 or what not, barely shot one round and you are loosing 12:0. If you are in heavy or even in medium, you can at least go to the flank where noone went and try to hold them or delay them. When you are in arty, you only hope that someone will go to the other flank

              • No, they do it because they’re scumbags. Not all arty drivers do that, but a lot do. I think I’ve done it twice only, and it was only when the team lost so horribly that the enemy team felt bad enough to just let me do it.

                • I never seen a reason for drowning, You pay more for repairs plus I feel always better when i can fight till the end.

          • People actually *do* tend to act strangely timidly when it comes to their virtual avatars, even – or particularly – in games where having those blown to shit is pretty much par for the course. Hence idiot lemmings dicking around at corners too scared to just take it on the chin and rush a patently outmatched opponent, and comparable behaviour in other FPSes. Eg. back when we still played DoD it was only too common to have to engage in “sacrificial leadership” (ie. go first as an example and usually get shot in the process) to get chickenshit teammates to actually move their asses and do something.

            The whole suicide-drowning thing is just griefing though, to speak nothing of bad sportsmanship.

            • I can stand noobs, i can stand people close to the edge of retardation. But being a coward in a game is too much for me. People who peek out, get shot and hide without returning fire, even thou there is only one player shooting at them. They get shot, they get scarried. It’s not even about being a coward or being a brave man. It’s all about thinking under “stress”

      • That would include myself btw (two tier X SPGs). The lesser of two evils.
        Just refund the XP and credits, and everything is fine. Unless, of course, these ppl are too afraid of leaving their bases and actually fight the enemy.

      • I have spent a lot of time grinding my arty and I would GLADLY give it away without any compensation if one day devs decide to remove the arty from the game whatsoever.

        • I used to be a dirty scumbag… well i say that now, but i actually never did the drowning thing. Weeeell maybe once or twice lol
          I grinded to tier9 arty on ussr and germany, and i was not sad to sell those things, Arty got what it deserved. Nerf was needed, only real scumbags think otherwise,. Arties are a pest that we would happily be without.

          Oh the amount of times i’ve had my top gun stolen cuz one little F*cker think our team doesnt deserve the last kill. I’ve even had a crucial contribution slip thru my fingers cause i could not catch him in time. That kind of cowardliness has no place in a tank game.
          Actually started playing arty again only to realize you really cant carry games like in a ordinary tank, AND YOU SHOULDN’t be able to!
          Acc. and the fact that HE is reather lackluster you only really dish out small amounts of dmg

      • lol
        Campers are not seen and thus have nothing to worry about. On other hand, people actually trying to push and secure key areas have a lot to worry about things coming from the sky which they have no control of. I wonder if it is a coincidence that after 8.6, the avg. battle duration dropped significantly, even in maps like Malinovka, formerly known as Kamperovka.
        A long long time ago, I researched the Maus. But as I now the crap it is, never really bought it. Then I gave it a try on test server. Everytime I tried to push and use my armor for my team, arty ruined the day. It is a boring gameplay mechanic which completely punishes movement and slow tanks.

        • “[...]people actually trying to push and secure key areas have a lot to worry about things coming from the sky which they have no control of.” <– They have control over the arty. MOVE YOUR ASSES! Seriously. The arty has worse accuracy and aimtime then any other tank type in this game!
          "Everytime I tried to push and use my armor for my team, arty ruined the day." <– You mean you lost 1100 (Obj261 HE shell) / 1550 (GW E100 HE) / 1800 (T92 HE) / 2200 (CGC HE) [all must have hit the sweetspots to deal this dmg and you get that after every MINUTE they shot!!!] out of 3000 HP with one shot and that was bad? Then never play with a T4-T8 scout. (hint: most tanks will oneshot all your hp)

  2. How to make HE useful? How about just make them realistic, but not completely whopping OP.

    85mm HE has some huge explosion forces. And the 152mm could rip turn anything inside a tank into human stew or just crack them open like a tincan. Obviously that would be significant balanced in the game though.

    I feel HE does too little damage you have to go for the extreme calibres to get any performance like the 152mm or the 122mm

  3. I have some idea how to historically nerf kv-1 and t-34 in historical battles:
    (since they said, there will be separate stat for the tanks in historical battles)

    1. Reduce radio range: every soviet tank has only the tier 1 Signal Flag (90m range) due the lack of radios.
    2. Reduce the view range of: KV-1 (from 310m to 250m) and the T-28 (from 320 to 260). Due the shitty optical equipment.
    3. Reduce the crew level of every soviet tank to 60% but the skills (sixth sense etc.) will be active. Because we all know the soviet crew was ill-trained.
    4. No gold ammo for T-34 and KV-1.
    5. No consumable for T-34 and KV-1 (There was a shortage of repair equipment in 1941)
    6. Introduce airstrikes.

    (that nerf only for 1941 Russian – German tank battles)

    • I think that those would work well. You could use similar policies in the Ardennes for the German tanks, like lack of modules or ammo.

    • All KVs had radios as standard kit AFAIK, the relatively few and already rather costly heavy tanks tending to have something of a priority for such accessories.

      The big problem in any case is that there’s basically *nothing* in a historical ’41 German lineup that’ll hurt those monsters, and preciously little even the T-34 needs to worry about. No towed artillery or heavy AA pieces around here.

      • PzIII with L/60 can penetrate(with AP shell) the side and rear of the T-34. Using wolfpack tactic if necessary.

        The real problem is the KV-1(and KV-2) because they are impenetrable from every side.

        • I know how to nerf the KV-2! :D :

          KV-2 can shoot only stationary and on flat ground and the turret must face parallel to the hull.

          http://www.warhistoryonline.com/war-articles/history-tanks-russias-kv-2.html

          “The Winter War showed many weaknesses of the KV-2 design. Their large mass caused them to sink in mud. The massive gun demanded that the KV-2 fired while stationary, hopefully on flat ground. Firing the 152mm howitzer during movement or while tilted could damage the tank. Furthermore, the small turret ring meant that shooting perpendicular to the hull was a bad idea. The turret might get jammed, or, even worse, the massive recoil would cause damage to the engine or transmission.”

          If you shoot during movement or on tilted ground it will damage you. If you shoot perpendiculat to the hull, there will be chance for your turret will be “destroyed” (it will become red) or you will be detracked or your engine will be damaged. Worst of all three at the same time XD.

        • Quick look at teh Wiki says the L/60 first started appearing in late ’41, so that’s already stretching it a little. And everything *else* is pretty much boned.

      • On paper, there is little to worry about. However the weakness especially of the T-34 was piss poor command and coordination, due to the fact that the commander was also the gunner. Cutting view range and radio range would help to simulate this.

        • Rather bad observation arrangements of the early turrets and flat-out shortages of radios in the medium tanks (it was apparently a common practice to dispense with the bow MG gunner/radio operator when a tank lacked the equipement) had rather more to do with that AFAIK, and are already factored into the stats.
          Well.
          Didn’t exactly help that in ’41 most crews were the same year’s conscripts fresh out of Basic and commanders thought themselves lucky if the lot had half a dozen driving hours under their belts…

          • All of these reasons added together make the reason why Russia lost 7 tanks for every 1 Germany lost, even though Russian armor was “superior.” I don’t know how historically accurate balance can be implemented into the game, considering so many of Russia’s issues have no bearing in WOT. The best way I can figure is to cut things like view range, radio range, crew skills etc.

            Besides, the T-34 in game now represents the entire evolution of the 76 as far as I know, when driving it elite you are driving the most improved model. That’s not what should be in HB. Even the stock version has advantage over the period model by having a radio, among other things.

            • As if picking suitable component setups for ’41-era HBs would be particularly difficult. I mean, have you actually *looked* at the softstats of the stock turret and gun? They get beat hands down by most *Tier One* stuff. o.O

              • They are definitely bad, but a 1941 T-34 would honestly be worse. 1941 t-34 has only -3 depression, very poor workmanship/material quality and almost no AP ammunition.

    • 2. Reduce the view range of: KV-1 (from 310m to 250m) and the T-28 (from 320 to 260). Due the shitty optical equipment.

      The US in their test said otherwise. Russian have low quality optic is nothing more than a nonsense

      • More to the point, the topic of optics isn’t even *relevant* here since the viewing arrangements of tanks were handled by vision slits with or without armoured glass blocks and/or assorted fairly simple periscopes.

        Early Soviet designs *were* often a tad lacking in that departement – but then that goes for eg. StuGs too – which is however already accounted for in the abysmal for the tiers viewranges of the afflicted turret modules.

    • Its strange how when talking about the tiger, you don’t need to do anything but change the gun to historical. But when It comes time for the Russians to have the large tanks, everybody is screaming to nerf them.
      The T-34 and KV-1 were beast tanks when the Germans started operation Barbarossa. Deal with it.

      • 1. When the Operation Barbarossa started, there was around 500 KV and 1000 T-34
        German had 1100 Tank with 50mm or larger guns. That’s 0,73:1 ratio for Russians. So in historical battles, there will be more KV and T-34 then Panzer III and Panzer IV. (remember in Kursk there was only 133 Tiger but the Soviets had lot of T-34, what can penetrate the side and rear of tiger.

        2. KV and the T-34 can penetrate the german tanks from every side. 5cm L/42 can penetrate(with AP)the sides and rear of T-34.(remember there’s more T-34 in 1941 then Panzer III). And here’s the ONLY weakspots of KV-1 from close range!: http://kepfeltoltes.hu/140325/shot_052_www.kepfeltoltes.hu_.jpg (The T-34 can penetrate the side and rear of Tiger I from close)
        With the Panzer IV gun (with HE) you have to damage the top of KV-1 back (because the HE didn’t bounce) or a small weakspot between the turret and hull.

        Panzer IV is the top tank of the Germans in 1941, but the Soviets in Kursk still have SU-152.

        • Anyway the Panzer IV with L/24 and Panzer III with L/42 have shoot ~10 time the T-34 to kill it and ~20 times to kill the KV-1. That’s not problem because the Tiger need 20 shoot to kill it, but there’s same amount of T-34 and KV as PanzerIII and Panzer IV. But the Tigers is outnumbered by T-34 (in the game that isn’t true because in test server nobody plays with T-34, because there’s the free xp to research the SU-152 or there’s no bonus reward for playing with T-34)

      • Of course we can deal with it from the historical point of view. It is widely accepted fact that in the 41 Soviet tanks outclassed German ones in armour and firepower.

        The problem here is of different nature. Operation Barbarossa looks very tempting as a theme for a historical battle.

        But in tank vs tank only scenario, in their historical setups, German tanks would stand no chance, unless they would keep respawning until Russians run out of ammo, and then they could cap the base. The only possible solution within current tank configurations would be to allow Germans to use arty to knock the Russian tanks out. But … give Germans too many arties and it will screw the Russians … give them only 1 or 2 and if they happen to be tomatoes they will single handedly screw over the whole German team.

        Compromises will have to be made, I’m afraid, even if it means a nerf to the Russians, for gameplay sake.

  4. - special “historical” characteristics (SS: mentioned in the earlier post today by Storm) will not apply for random battles, vehicles will not be balanced with historical battles in mind, because “it’s not needed”

    But it would be a very, very good idea. They need to rework the Tiering system. Now there are multiple tanks per tier in a single line I think they’ve opened the door to this. They should…

    1) Reduce the overall number of Tiers, either to 8 or even 7. (With Tier’s 1 and the top tier being one vehicle per Tier per line).
    2) Balance Alpha damage and HP better. Tier 1 should start out at about Tier 2 health, Top Tier should have able Tier 7 or 8 health and everything in between should be balanced.

    If you start changing numbers to fit historic battles for “balance” then it just points out the obvious imbalance in regular game mode. Don’t do that. Give players 1 set of stats per tank to remember.

  5. I hope we will get customizable accesories, I would like to patch my weakspots with track parts, sandbags, zimmerit, mesh, Schurzen or wood.

  6. did anyone notice the bug on ruinberg on fire? you can’t drive down any trees anymore. I don’t konw if it’s on any other maps.

  7. developers are still waiting for programmers to finish…..

    so there are developers that wait for programmers? what kind of developing are they doing, and are developers a different role then programmers?

    interesting stuff

    • Yes, that’s why suggest somebody becomes part of the game industry before they sperg on forums about WG.
      Programmers Developers Producers Artists and Researchers all rely on each other to get to the finished project. But of course if the Programmers are behind, nothing will get done.

  8. - according to Storm, having several “realism” modes of random battles á la War Thunder is not viable. He states that in War Thunder, the first mode is played by 95 percent people, the second 3,5 percent and the third the rest, so the two other modes are pointless

    Bullshit, it’s more like 50% / 40% / 10%

    - implementing respawning is not “copying War Thunder”, according to Storm – garage battles were discussed by the time War Thunder was not out yet

    That’s true but only WT showed them that it can work.
    What’s even funnier is the fact the they made jokes about the respawn in WT and said it’s a stupid idea some months ago…

    PS. I am not an fanboy on either of both games but it just get’s tired about the WT bashing from them, i mean it’s like some kids bashing each other about who has the better toy truck.

    • It’s not BS. Player support for the different modes isn’t all that great. Part of it is that few players do play those modes so many players who might are driven away do to low participation. And more players who might play say “historic battles” in WT don’t because of elitist assholes who make a big deal about how good you have to be (when Jingles has shown you don’t) to play HBs.

      I think you’re falling into the “I like it so it must be popular” trap.

    • It’s caused by sound mods since the micropatch yesterday so you have to remove all your sound mods until they are updated.

  9. “according to Storm, having several “realism” modes of random battles á la War Thunder is not viable.”

    Nothing important but ‘á la’ is actually written ‘à la’. It doesn’t really bother me but just wanted to let you know for the next time you use it =)

  10. “there is currently no need to buff artillery”

    BS, arty needs some buffs after 8.6 – its a pomposity to say they dont need buff.
    Since that scumbag Zlobny was fired there is still hope for some artybuffs.

  11. HE should have less damage than it is now, but the splash radius should be a lot bigger. That way, artillery could behave like a area denial weapon instead of snipers. The penetration should be a bit higher so that 76mm HE could deal some damage to 100mm armor. As for the arty hatred, it’s not players’ fault. WG didn’t balance them properly. They suicide because they knew they don’t have a chance, and they don’t feel like giving their enemy a free kill. Compared to tanks, arty have a lot less hitpoints, a lot less armor, poor camo, horrible aim time, terrible accuracy, no gun depression and most have no turret. As for those who say the game is campy, I would say it’s caused by monstrous TDs like WT E100s or FV183s.

  12. “implementing respawning is not ‘copying War Thunder’, according to Storm”

    Did somebody actually say that respawning is copying War Thunder?!?!

    Since the dawn of video games, maybe even as old as pen & paper games or older, we had it.

    I’m sorry, that’s just somebody arguing for the sake of arguing.

  13. “- developers are wondering how to increase HE rounds usefulness, but haven’t thought of anything yet”

    Well the reason I don’t like using HE (or HEAT) is because they get almost completely absorbed by spaced armour or tracks. Some might say “go around the tank and shoot an HE there, no spaced armor there” but hey if I’m behind it I might as well shoot an AP. HEs aren’t for flanked tanks (unless it’s a Foch) it’s for when you can’t pen it’s front. So imo they can roughly leave HE shells as they are now and instead look at spaced armour.

  14. “historical battles themsleves took roughly a month of work, including the tests”

    And it shows.

    Another rush job to be pulled at the next patch, if not before.

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