Source: http://world-of-ru.livejournal.com/3338685.html
Hello everyone,
Russian LJ user Tikhonovetskiy compiled the changes in tank destroyer camouflage after shooting. Now, to make sense of the numbers – they are based on the data, gathered (via trials) by Russian players. How exactly it works is explained in this older post on FTR (I suggest you check it out), but basically, the percentage value displays the percentage, by which the spotting distance of a tank is reduced when compared to ideal case (as in, for example if the number is 10 percent and you have a tank that would ideally spot everything at 1000 meters, it gets spotted at 1000 – (10 percent, eg. 1000) = 900 meters instead).
The table is unfortunately in Russian, but here is what the numbers mean:
First number after the name of the vehicle is camo reduction when the vehicle is standing
Second number is camo reduction when the vehicle is moving
Third number is camo reduction when the vehicle shoots
Fourth number (next to the gun name) is camo reduction when the vehicle shoots, how it was in 9.0
Obviously these values are for the gun, written in the last column.
So for example the first case, AT-1 – in 9.0, the shooting camo reduction was 7,70 percent, in 9.1 it is 5,05 percent (which means a reduction to two thirds of the original value). Also, as you can see, prems weren’t touched. Oddly enough, WT E-100 got actually its shooting camo buffed if I see it correctly.
Soviets
Germans
Everyone else
still camo isnt that bad and that nerf doesnt feel so much as arty nerf
the bush mechanics are stronger than a mere 1-2% cammo nerf.
Any smart player can still stay back 15m behind a bush, and remain unspotted while firing; that way, in the ELC AMX, which never had any bonus, and other tanks, I can continue to invisibly troll pubbies from even a mere 100m away. The farming of false hacks accusations from the ignorant shall continue!
Fortunately about 70% of players don’t do that, they sit in the middle of the bush, and in that case, the camo nerf is pretty noticeable, especially when a Stug just pops up in the bush and get’s hammered by everyone. Lesson learned, don’t stay near the first line tanks :D
Errm….why should the ELC AMX have a any bonus? Your post sounds like it should have one (otherwise it doesn’t make sense to state that it hadn’t), but it is just a light tank as any other light tank (except featuring a TD gun), including the bonus of having the same bonus while moving as if it would be stationary.
He never said (or implied, in my opinion) that the ELC should have a bonus. It’s just an example of a tank commonly used as a TD even when it isn’t. The ELC is pretty good at it too, being so small, maneuverable and with a great punch.
The ELC AMX is a light TD. It has very poor view range and a poor radio as well. Not exactly what I would classify as scout characteristics. There are of course light tanks in the game that are not scouts
If thye have good enough view range, they can spot you even when 15+m behind the bush, it’s just that the bush keeps providing between 10 and 50% camo. Meaning a 440+m view range tank will spot you around the 200m mark.
Some buffs in high tier TD’s?
Well the WT E100 did not have any camo at all after it shot and the increase to 0,06% is still ****. It has 0,4% standing still :))))) So at 400m the reduction is a wooping 1,6m :))))))
I decided to go down the WT line and im not a very good player so far i have the rhm and its a desaster i dont play well in it so i guess more suck then……..
For me a shooting camo reduction that has been lowered (7.70% > 5.05% AT-1) is actually a buff. If you lower a camo reduction you actually increase camo.
So i think that in your explicative text you messed up the 2 values. 7,70% is the 9.1 value 5.05% was the old.
“So for example the first case, AT-1 – in 9.0, the shooting camo reduction was 5,05 percent, in 9.1 it is 7,70 percent”
This should be the right text. I think.
last (fourth) column: higher than third should mean more camo reduction, so a nerf
That is exactly what i said… The text of the article is misleading the table is right.
The lower the number, the more like you are to get seen. So if you were to get spotted at 400 meters with a 25% camo factor it would be 300 meters. With a 5% camo factor it will be 380 meters.
hm confusing, you might be right, so column three is 9.1 and four is 9.0 i guess
No, yo’re are reading it wrong.
In case of Soviet AT-1:
- it WAS 7.70% which means that after shooting your original cammo value was reduced to 7.7% (not reduced by 7.7%) of the base value
- it IS now 5.05% which means that you only retain 5.05% of your original cammo value after shot
It is clearly a nerf, not a buff.
Yes ok why not. If so 7.70% is not a shooting camo reduction. It is a camo value after shooting.
Very big difference. Text is misleading anyway and has to be fixed.
Because SS made a mistake – all those numbers are not a “camo reduction” but “visibility reduction” so in other words – camo.
so the bigger the better
SU-101 was next to useless before, the only good thing was its camo. Now its been nerfed hard and really will be totally useless.
It’s going to been seen when firing 8.5 meters further away than it was before; hardly a huge nerf.
I really like the SU101; insane DPM, just never try fighting over a hill with it.
I played last night only as the Obj.704 and didn’t feel like anything had changed and reading the figures, the difference is not that much really when in the grand scheme of things. And as has been mentioned already, if you play right, then the nerf doesn’t really effect.
It’s only a matter of been seen a few meters further away when firing. Not a huge nerf.
Things like full skilled Hellcats which built upon the 9.0 number will feel very different.
The problem always has been full skill crews+camo nets+camo paint added up to 55% for some tanks.
So reducing a tank by lets say 7% to 5% base is large and I think this will heavily balance tanks like Hellcat whos camo was abused by good players with 4 skill crews+camo nets.
So biggest thing was Camo Nets remained active for TD`s. Does this still apply while shooting?
Because Camo net is like taking a bush with you in a Hellcat/Romba
Oh I never ever actually fired from a bush anyways, it still meant getting spotted at most engaging distances. If one stays behind it means almost nothing. And net stays active for shooting.
“Oddly enough, WT E-100 got actually its shooting camo buffed if I see it correctly.”
For WT E-100 camo is irrelevant anyway, anyone can see it from wherever it is…
Asked for a retarded way to nerf OP TD?
Nerf them all.
Fosh line must be fun to play now.
Next patch, they remove french track! Because french TD are moving, to strong :).
Not only the Foch’s are OP, most of the tier 9 and 10 TD’s are, they can pen everything and their armor’s stronker than the heavies’ armor. So at least they can nerf their camo, at least let them be spotted more easily. And its perfectly logical, why should they remain invisible when they fire such huge guns?
Yea, it will be even more “fun” to play those under-powered TD’s like ARL V39 or alternate RU line Tier7/8 with more nerfs to them..
I agree. Somua S40, S35 CA, ARL V39 and the 2nd USSR TD line should have other characteristics buffed after this. Not to mention tanks whose only advantage was the low-profile and camo like UE 57, Hetzer, JagdPz 4.
I actually liked the S35 CA. Having a 105mm gun on tier 5 TD with a nice gun traverse was really cool :D
Finally, us paying customers get our money’s worth out of the premium TDs. :)
Pretty fucking retarded nerf. Every TD gun of a caliber equal or bigger than 100mm had almost no camo bonus after shot so there was nothing lost and TDs that were underpowered, now are even worse.
I’ve been saying this for long already, that camo nerf after shooting doesnt change much. You can still remian invisible if you know how to use bushes, and you will still suck if you dont have a clue.
BTW
The translation, as can be seen above, may be misleading to (new) players who are not familiar with camo system in wot.
Also, E-25 is retarded and the ultimate tear collecting machine. Nothing new here, though.
E-25 is truly the ultimate tear collecting machine. Tears of tanks it caught with it’s machinecannon.
It now has better camo when firing than the Renault UE 57. Wow.
A cosmetic change that doesn’t help at all.
What we need is a better balanced spotting system in general. You either have high viewrange and bad camo (JP E-100) or you have great camo and bad viewrange (what the Borsig, WT auf Pz IV, ISU, Obj 704, Obj 268, etc. should be like)
The current system is imbalanced, because the flat tanks have it all.
Which is kinda logical, isn’t it?
If you have some small TD with open top, then of course you will have good camo factor AND good view range, because there’s nothing in your way of seeing things, right?
This makes sense as well. But you also need to consider the heigth of vehicle – low profile vehicles are a bit worse due to… low profile :)
Not at all. The one that has problems with “things in your way” is the flat one. The 5m high monster does not, because it is 5m high. Take a friend and let him climb up a 5m high house. Then climb on a 2m high rock. Compare who has the better viewrange. (pro tip: the one at 5m)
And btw, you do know that they invented telescopes for closed vehicles to see things further than the human eye, don’t you?
Great they nerfed the TD’s so the bad players can stop crying now. But wait they didn’t nerf the premium TDs. All that means is that I will target the premium TDs first! I will sit in the back and wait for the E25′s to show themselves, only when they are killed will I move up!
pls don’t go full retard. You already sit in the back, this changes nothing in your gameplay.
Did you even read the list or do you really lack a basic grasp of understanding regarding the game’s mechanics? Nevermind answering, keep trolling.
List easily proves, that there was barely any point to this nerf in the first place. I continue to laugh at the “OMG TDs ARE DEAD” doom-preachers from before patch… Firing camo always came from bushes, remains to come from bushes and I’ll still ram right into WTE-100s in my 59-16 before I have a chance of spotting him.
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Nerf TDs more!