On TD Viewrange Nerf

Hello everyone,

just a quick post explaining something. Many of you were shocked yesterday by the upcoming tier 9 and 10 tank destroyer viewrange, which is:

FV4004: 320 meters
FV4005: 330 meters

While current viewrange tier 10 tank destroyers is (examples):

Object 268: 400 meters
Object 263: 410 meters
WT E-100: 420 meters

etc. (basically between 400-420 meters). So why introduce vehicles, that have such a low viewrange suddenly? Well, the answer is (unfortunately/fortunately) simple. I asked around and there is a massive viewrange nerf coming (likely in 9.5, the nerf was announced earlier by Storm). It will definitely concern tank destroyers (they will have viewrange nerfed to the FV4004/4005 levels) and it’s possible it will concern other vehicles to certain extent. Details are unfortunately not known yet, it’s not even in testing yet.

The goal of this nerf is to improve the role of light tanks and scouting in the game.

282 thoughts on “On TD Viewrange Nerf

      • Overall view range nerf needed – if just TDs, whats the point? People will roll into MTs and HTs then.
        Ooooor – the Scout Wars has begun :D

        • I’m okay with nerfing the heavy/medium tank view ranges too as long as they don’t touch vehicles like the Leopards. As they are medium/light hybrids with nothing else than their view range to keep them alive.

          So yeah, this sounds like awesome news as long as they adjust the view ranges for each vehicle individually.

        • Wouldn’t it be cool if the view range nerf was similar across all classes? Perhaps tier 8 lights would even have a place in tier 10 clan wars and companies/skirmishes. :)

        • People already roll into MTs and HTs. TDs have already been nerfed that hard. Overnerfed, that is, and they still want to nerf them even further? Are they trying to repeat the situation they created by overnerfing artillery to the point where everyone started driving TDs? They’re just going full circle where in 2 years time the Tier X vehicles aren’t even a match for current Tier 2 vehicle. Negative power creep, is what I’m saying.

          • because clearly thats going to happen when arty wasn’t buffed at all and yet everyone flocked back to artillery.

      • Nice tactic WG. We haven’t time to do biger maps so we will nerf viev range of all td in game! Rly nice, after this game for me will be totaly shit and crap. I am not doing any td’s tech tree but i have jg88 so it will by fu****g shit for me and my style of play…

        • You’re completely missing the point. First, WG IS actually testing bigger maps. Second, whatever the map size, given the ingame mechanics we have, TDs and HTs are too powerful with viewranges that make them overall very – too – performant and self-sufficient. If an overall VR nerf was introduced, a massive one for TDs and HTs and a minor one for MTs, LTs would be not only nice to play again but also USEFUL AT LAST. Currently this is a tank cathegory totally worthless playing apart from fun because nobody actually >> needs << them to spot for you (since the arty nerf). A VR nerf would rebalance both the LT and the currently OP TD cathegories. This is not at all a matter of map sizes, don't mix it all.

        • If you are having to spot for yourself in most tds you are probably doing it wrong anyway….

    • I’m not. I love playing StuG. it has 310 viewrange.. now what ? bring it down to 200 ?

      for high tier TDs with the amount of health same as heavies, yes, this is good move, but what about the lower tiers, paper tds ? No armor, 300hp, low alpha… and now I have to be even closer ?

      • Scout tanks will scout for you, supposedly. Most TD’s were meant for defensive ambushes and supporting fire so I guess they want to push them into the ”supporting” role. Of course doing this much to the Tortoise / T95 / T100E3-4 tanks who are generally on the front line is a bit much…

        • TDs without too much camo will hopefully get some more view range than their camouflaged counterparts. i.e. Maybe 360 instead of 320.

          • I’d rather let them have 350, it’s enough to at least spot tanks that are shooting at you from nearby but not enough to spot passive scouts in bushes. Camoflaged turreted TD’s have always been a problem in WOT, It’s just that the waffles the hellcat was just taken for granted in tier 6 games…

            • I’d rather have all TDs at 250. With 350 they can still use binos and get to 437+ so where’s the nerf?? 320m + binos means exactly 400m so you still have a chance to sneak in when they are repositioning. Plus a 400m light + optics (440m) would have a chance to spot the camper TD before it gets spotted. But this is just math on paper, we will see what will happen in game, I for one agree 100% with the 300-320m nerf. It happened too many times when only 3-4 TDs were left in the enemy team and they were camping as hell, this is a good step towards changing that or at least making the battle more towards skill than ‘who can see the enemy before they see you’.

              I would say take it to the next level and nerf arty view range to 200m and remove the proximity spot or make it much smaller than it is now. Or make it dynamic like on the move -> 50m, stationary -> 10-20m. Will open new tactics compared to the current ‘let’s hug a rock to spot everyone behind that rock’.

              Then the fun will start ;)

          • Could be even justified. If a tank is taller, it will have less camo, but likely it would also offer better view at the surrounding area.

        • scout tanks scout for TD’s are you kidding they wont do that a majority go off on their own and die right at the beginning of the map and when you ask for assistance they ignore you 99% of the time … so TD’s using a scout to do its actual job as a scout … Get real

    • You really shouldn’t, removing almost all bushes and flattening most maps + adding corridors shouldn’t be countered by a general view range nerf so lights can scout in the middle of the open map with 0 cover be it solid or not.

      They need to stop fk’ing up the maps because the way they are going, high tier scouts (from 6 and above) already barely have any reasons to scout as opposed to playing as mediums with no armor.

    • no, no this is very bad! very bad indeed!
      I think you may all be forgetting to take into account one VERY important fact here chaps. The people who play WoT’s…… are TERRIBLE at WoT’s!

      And how often do you see your scouts suicide and kill themselves right in the first minute of the game. If that happens when this nerf happens (and it will, I promise you) all of your Team will be left pretty much blind! And if the enemy teams scout is any good than the enemy will have an ENORMOUS advantage, so much so that if you happen to be on a wide open map like malinovka, than your chances of winning unless you can kill their scout ( which will be almost impossible because you won’t have the view range to even have a chance of spotting him) are almost next to none.

      So in the end we will have a system where the entire outcome of the match for your teams will be at the mercy of weather of not those players at the bottom of your team list are any good.

      • Nah! Now LT’s are worthless at their job, and that is spotting. What’s the point of it if every tank has similar VR, using optics gets you to the hard cap (445), and that hard cap isn’t much less than the drawing distance. The only other thing that they could do to change this is to increase the max spotting range, and drawing distance, but servers and optimization…

        LTs will be much more precious, and will be priority target like arty is now. Things will change, and it’s hard to tell how will it be, but I think that unexperienced players won’t be playing LTs that much, cause they will be more rewarding but also harder to play. As a LT fan I’m wainting for those changes.

    • I think this is a good idea, the scouts will be more valuable and defended more GG WG!

  1. I’m actually ok with this…as things currently stand, driving a light scout is basically useless, because mediums do everything scouts do besides camo, but better. Hell, even the new scouts are best played more as hyper mobile mediums with epic camo than as passive spotters….

    • yeah well scouts have been useless since they nerfed arty and made them rare! since then, scouts have been turning to be dmg dealers and try to stay safe and kill some low hp tanks from behind!

      but still ruining tds, and nerfing them to the ground is ridiculous, if heavies and meds get the same view nerf it goes!

    • to me, this sounds like a huge nerf to whole team.

      I mean, okay, if you are good at playing LTs. But what I mostly see, is Stuarts suiciding in first 30 seconds. They just run to enemies. Spotting them while none of us is in range to actually do anything or didnt even load the gun …

      And now what ? blind game, Whats the point of snipers if tehy have to be close to enemies ?
      I ll be okay with this when my stug gets armor and higher alpha
      With teh amount of health it has, it can be oneshot by almost anything. Now if I have to be even closer, they can as well remove gun completely. I wont be shooting at enemies. Once I shoot Im dead because tehy alreay nefed camo after shooting.

      • Yeah thought exactly the same. Too many suicide scouts. Guess it’s just “moar heavy and corridor” crap then.

        • Well hmm i must admit i scout quite often (having the 2801 as my most played tank) but there are two problems today: even if you tell the team where you will spot and in which direction….and you spot enemies…noone of the team even tries to fire at the spotted tanks (yes team is in firing range) or drive 40m to a very good firing position. Just yesterday during countdown on Malinovka i clearly stated 3 times that i will make an initial scouting run straight to the middle of the open field (not like that “scout” idiots that drive to the water side road spotting nothing..) and than break to the right (i do this almost everytime on this map as a scout without getting hit), and asked them to aim right for the other side. NOONE did even aim in that direction, all just lemminged away from the base to the hill. So again 5-8 enemies spotted 10 seconds after the game started…no damage done by the team. The second point: whilst you get a lot of XP for dmg assisted…you don’t get any WN7/8 points for that (that’s why i think those ratings are broken…being a scouting scout is good for the game but you get much more points if you play your LT like a paper MT that makes 300dmg than having 5k dmg spotted?!?)

          • “you don’t get any WN7/8 points for that ”
            Let me ask you this… what can you buy for those points ?
            Can you put them to you curriculum vitae ?
            Ok, I know, there are players who play only for stats… but then again.. if you got so much dmg assist, it means you will probably win the match.

            To me, it means very little… seeing player having 60% winrate and 500 battles… cool! show me your main account! Everybody was beginner once.
            I bet it also took him over 2000 battles to learn to play… but they are usually hiding their main accounts, ashamed of the loses they had experience in order to become what they are now…

            About ignorance and not shooting, you described on malinovka… you are right, it happens very often.
            What I usually do, I dont tell them i will spot, I ask them if snipers are ready and want me to spot. If nobody answers – meaning they dont give a fuck, theres no point going there I think.

            • You probably won’t be able to do much with your ranking outside the game. But it is true for about any game there is, unless you’re professional playing for money, and you’re looking for some pro team to invite you.

              But …

              There is no end-game so people find their own motives to play. Some do it to drive over destructible objects, bump into team mates and suck hard while excusing it with playing for fun. Some others like to give it their best and see how well they are doing compared to the rest. Sadly, WG’s own rating sucks cocks left and right, and so, whether players like it or not, user made ratings, such as WN8, offer the most accurate tool to compare oneself with others, to establish own place on the skill ladder.

              • I would like to know where WGs rating “sucks cocks”.
                At least it takes scouting into account, better than WN8…

                • Because it factors in the # of battles which is why you see botters with 100k battles with super borked PR over people who more skilled. plus damage is concrete, and good players WILL do damage regardless. WN8 goes off of expected values, so it is harder to pad in a T54 or T18 as opposed to WG metric which does not factor in expected damage in all tanks.

      • Because it never happens that it is not lights but the top tier heavies being played by idiots, dying in the first minutes of the battle and MAYBE doing 1 damaging shot.

        No sir. Idiots are everywhere, in any class, on any tier. If you happen to have too many of them in the team you’re fucked regardless what they drive.

        • You dont need to be an idiot to die in the first minute, I often push flanks and get totally flanked just because my team mates holds back and not wanting to shoot on enemies and take some damage. There are still too much campy mentality in the game, because majority of players dont know how to brawl, how to make damage and avoid getting shot back (by using superior positioning).

          • Sorry you misunderstood me or maybe i wasn’t precise enough: i dont give a shit on the WN8, especially with all the statpaddern, pedobears (least time 1 saw one with 20k out of his 22k games in Leichtraktor only…) and “gold”skillers. But as there is quite a few amount of people that take that serious, it could explain why scout tanks are played the wrong way by more and more ppl. I still prefer spotting (both in 2801 and T71) and pick some sweets (arty, Tortoise, Rhm Borsig WT etc) late game for myself ;)

  2. Something off topic SS.Since they didn’t change Soviet 122 HE shell damage back to 465 in 9.4, are they going to do anything about this?

  3. I love WG’s old-country approach to things….

    Scouts need to be useful ? Maps are too small? No problem , just make everyone else see less! Problem fixed!

    Jokes aside…its ok i guess…I just got out of BDR 75mm Hell, so couldn’t be concerned with much else.

    • It’s easier to reduce viewranges of non-LTs than to rework every map in the game to be bigger.

      • Better to make big maps in the first place….

        They said that players “couldn’t cope” with bigger maps
        They said that bigger maps would not enhance gameplay….

        Ooo.. look WG are experimenting with bigger maps..??
        And then nerf view range AND camo on the the tanks that NEED view range and camo the most..

        Much fucking sense….

        • Yeah, they should make bigger maps in the first place. Although then they would still need to rework all the others to make them bigger as well, or restrict them to lower tiers where the view ranges are smaller.

        • The official answer is none of the above (unless you mean atrocities like 2000 x 2000 and more, where it’s actually a valid answer), but that it’s engine, and mostly server, heavy. But they’ve been trying to increase the size for years anyway.

          Pay attention, please.

          • I have been paying attention… SerB has stated that players wouldn’t be able to cope with bigger maps and that the gameplay would suffer… If I could be arsed I would search back for the Q&A where he says this.. but I can’t be arse..

            ..and yes.. anything SerB says “is official”… even if its informal…

            They have been testing larger maps.. PvE… still larger maps, however you try to spin it.

            Pay attention.

          • This is, frankly, just an assumption. Why would the server process more on bigger maps? it’s still 15v15. More objects mean more memory not more CPU. But at the same time CPU power/memory density/disk speed has increased every year substantially so there is ‘room’ to grow. On the other hand people still play on Windows XP (look at minimum requirements – video card from 2004) . I think they will not go with bigger maps ror the fear that they will have a large number of draw battles. People will just hide from or avoid the enemy.

              • Really….?

                Not THAT much more.. its still 30 players interactions, only difference it the relative position on the map… which the server won’t care whether the grid ref is B1 shooting D5 compared to B10 shooting F22….

                really.. how MUCH more data when teh only difference is what each tank interacts with plus distance???

  4. Great… so all gameplay will be in the hands of the idiotest of players, those suicide tomato scouts who are dead after 30 seconds in the game…

    • true some don’t know how to scout, sometimes there is nothing much to scout in some maps or area of maps, other cases are if you don’t go ahead to spot you get insulted and reported, and then you might go and die, even tho you knew it was not safe to spot, but some greedy camper convinced everybody to report you if you don’t scout so he can do dmg!

      • Yeah, I’ll continue contributing myself, please. Go spot for yourself, idiot.
        Scum. They think the entire team are their slaves…

        The best part is when they fail to follow up on your spotting.

    • I dunno how you guys are playing tds, generally the huge brawl of heavies and mediums fighting 400m in front spots everything for me …..

      If you are in a td should you not be in a position where you can give supporting fire to the main fight from where the enemy can’t see you, or am i totally missing the point?

  5. But another accuracy nerf was mentioned too. So my jpz e100 will be more inaccurate (with that barrel as huge as a chimney) and he was totally blind. With the narrow gun arc it will be impossible to defend itself.

    I am not happy.

    • My Jagdpanzer actually sees pretty well :o but I use it as a heavy tank and succeed, so I don’t even care. If you want to kemp bush you are in a wrong tank.

  6. And welcome back, shooting bushes.
    Screw bush camo nerf by 25%, while spot range goes also down.

    • this will make tds without cover and blind, so no tds will dare to advance and push anymore, camping will be huge!

      • No, people just won’t play TDs. Which is better for everyone.

        Just like arty nerf.

    • Where else CAN they be buffed? Max view is 445m, scout with optics is 440. They can’t make scout view range any longer.

      • Sigh.

        Max spotting distance is 445m, not max view range. Having 500m plus view range is already a thing. 500m view range against even something like a T54 (15% base camo) still doesn’t take you to max spotting distance.

        A WT E100 can have up to 606m view range, that can spot a full camo skill enemy scout like amx 13 90 400-410m away. Your 440m scout with optics would only see it 290-300m away. If the WT E100 has a camo net (takes camo value to about 15%) or some bush cover and hasn’t opened fire at something else it will spot the incoming 13 90 before it is spotted itself. Of cours ewhen it shoots and kills the 13 90 it will be spotted but that doesn’t help the scout much.

  7. i like the idea too…but maybe it should not be so drastic, let say nerf it from 400-420 to 340-350..

  8. Let me guess: Heavy tanks viewrange will remain the same right ? I mean, let’s give heavies all the aid and help there is, because they are always sooo defenseless against all those mean TD-s.

  9. and after 9.5 td’s will be either rare, or camp the shit out of the bushes and corners!

  10. Well is WG even thinking? Of course not…… Let’s put the viewrange down. What can go wrong. I mostly thik of the TDs with paper armor which depens on a log range combat. Those will suffer the most as the enemy is much closer and will more easier spot them……
    I am not amused.

    • Well if you “thik” better you’ll notice that with this nerf, they’ll fulfill their actual role of fire support and will need to be at the back of their team doing their part, rather than fapping in a bush somwhere with superior both camo and viewrange and frustrating everyone else since the “td flush out” mecanic no longer is reliable(i.e. artillery).

      • Well I agree to a certain point, but now think about all these scouts who mostly rush in and die in the very beginning. The support can only work proper if the scout does his job right. And well I overall look at these way to strong russian tanks with superior armor, gun, speed etc. And dont start with that they reload long and are not that accurate. So far I have never encounterd one inaccurate russain tank.

        • Actually, a medium or a heavy in front of you works as well, supposed the enemy has the same “quality” scout that suicides. Not only scouts can spot. And if the other side’s scout is properly scouting, they just deserved it, right?

    • When playing TD I do very rarely spot by myself the enemy I’m shooting at. The exceptions are UE57, FCM Pak, SU-85B. Their WR is 70% – my overall is 51% – go figure…

  11. That’s very good. Less TD is only good. More MT and HT is good cos its a game about fockin tanks, not arty and td’s ;)

    • it will destroy balance! you’ll be begging for the camping td to come and help you, and he’ll say: sorry no blind tank! and you will die without support!

      • Why did you advance beyond your support anyway. I mean for him not to be able to help you must be engaging enemies 707m away from him or behind a bottleneck. In which case let the enemy come to you and die, you know teamwork and stuff.

    • Yes, but now it’s going to be a game about whichever team gets the best scout. If render range isn’t also nerfed then you’ll have scouts spotting you from 200m and you’ll be shot from 400m with NO chance to spot the tanks shooting you!

      • Take proper cover, hide better behind bushes, get a good scout?

        Goddamnit, that’s what SCOUTS are for! It’s always the same, nerf the HT because they are hard to pen, nerf TDs, because they camp, nerf arty because alpha and indirect fire, nerf mediums because they are too versatile and now nerf light tanks (or, since they are overnerfed, prevent buffing them), because they spot too well?

        It’s their roles, man! Currently light tanks have almost nothing for them except camo on move. Speed, alpha/DPM, view range, HP pool, anything a proper MT can do better.

      • Instead the td should outspot the scout every single time and he dies without seeing anything?

  12. This is very interesting concept, really. I’m thinking if tier 10 TDs get around 330-340 metres view range, maybe meds on X get 370. This could really affect ways organized games are played.

    Think about CW battle in Malinovka. You want to see the coast for possible snipers or rushes. Medium with coated optics would see around 400, if enemy has camo pimped medium you spot it around 350. Light tank could have 400-410 metres base view range. With right perks this tank would spot like tier X medium today, but could also relocate with less risk of getting spotted and shot into face.

    I’m very much ok with this changed because it makes light tanks viable again as spotters. It would also be indirect arty buff for random matches because it would cause a bit more camping. Maybe enough to compensate for sixth sense for everyone?

  13. Well, all of a sudden having a pair of Binos on a Tier X TD becomes a very valid choice!

    Just hope the other classes (except LTs, duh!) will receive the same treatment.

    • 320m + binos = 400m, look at that ! :) (330+binos = 412m) so slap a pair of binos and you’re at the previous range, as long as you don’t move the hull.

      • For me, proper shooting range is 400-450 meters. At that distance I’m GUARANTEED to not get spotted when firing my TD gun.

        Now first of all there’s almost nowhere where you can get that sort of engagement distance in today’s maps.

        Second of all, you are all conveniently forgetting the CAMO effect on many tanks!

        So no, I will NOT spot that Medium at 400m with Binos active, I will spot him at 300 meters or less! At that range, if I fire I will be spotted anyhow!

        Seriously, I hope they drop this pants-on-head retarded idea. It would literally kill off the entire TD class, except for those that piss off people the most, which is the one-shot/one-clip wonders.

        • Use hardcover in TDs then, shoot and pull back, that is how I played my 3500+ games in my ferdinend. Or support heavys and mediums at flanks. Some people think that TDs always camped behind bushes but this isnt right, since back in the days accuracy was worse = even TDs had to move closer to make damage. The current campy TD gameplay is just rewarded due to the fact accuracy got better in 8.6 as well as fixed camo on paint and net. I was againt accutracy buff in 8.6 because in 8.5 I could actually move with my ferdinand and bounce shots from distance, once 8.6 came live that changed and effectively one was forced to play more passive. This was not good.

  14. This will be great! I hate to face TD when it come to the end of the game….. And I hope they will consider giving some upderpower TD a better viewrange like the 263

  15. Nerfing TDs viewrange will make the binocular telescope mandatory. That means TDs will camp even more.

    Nerfing viewrange of other tank classes except light tanks will totally broke mechanics of random battles – whole team will be dependent on a few light-tank players and their skill. Random team with bad scouts will lose even with good players driving other classes.

    Time to say goodbye to WoT.

      this will give teams no choice but to rely on a random team mate to know how to spot and play the game properly…does any one like that idea…ANY ONE???????
      this is going to be a fucking disaster if this happens

  16. This will break the game with this massive nerf on the view range for all but LT. The games will be decided by almost solely by how good the LT player are on the teams. And there will not be many LT on the teams, 1 to 3 LT´s.

    Good LT player – stay a live, effective spotting and giving eyes for the team.
    Bad LT player – YOLO rush and dies first 2 min, leaves the team blind.

    Blowout game. GG, was close. Fun.

      • You response clarify that you don’t understand or have experience how much a good/bad scout can influence a game. This depends somewhat on the map, but generally a good scout player will always have a strategy on every map to make a significant influence on the outcome.

    • That good LT player still needs a team good enough to capitalize on his efforts…
      And I think Mediums will still get the job done. The balance should be like Medium+Bino >/= Light+Optics.

      • If a good scout give targets to shoot at even the most deep red tomato will shoot, specially arty. And it also depends when and how he make his effort; beginning, mid and end game. The new LT´s have a good punch and speed to carry themselves very well and give good damage. So now they are not only just spotters, they are solid damage givers when they need to be.

        • It’s not only about shooting – also about knowing to push or to go elsewhere if there is a Scout at my flank and no targets are lit up…

    • Such nonsense. TD should be giving support fire from behind his team anyway, he isn’t meant to be the spotter. And since half the maps are alleys the combat all happens from inside spotting range anyway. All it means is that now what few open spaces there are in the game will not be no go areas because there might be 1 WT E100 sitting in a bush spotting half the map.

  17. If this piece of info is true, then – Woo Hoo! After recent news, I thought, WG just can’t go into even deeper retard mode. Never was I so wrong…

    They simply can’t do things normal way by changing something in little steps. If nerf something, then nerf it massively! Why bother to reduce the view range by 10-20 meters, when you can take off 70-80. I would understand this, if at the moment all TD’s would have average 70% win rate and light tanks 30%.
    It’s really easy to predict, how will this end, if they continue such “rebalance” – camping in bushes again will go sky-high, because no TD will be able to spot for himself (if they will nerf the view range for other classes, then those tanks will camp too). And in such a battle, if those all seeing Sauron scouts will die like now after 1 minute of battle time, then everyone will be afraid to move at all. Even now in all those new corridor maps non-turreted paper TD’s are next to useless, wtf will happen after additional view range nerf?

    And even bigger problem nr.2 arises! Now you have few by some people considered OP Premium TD’s like E-25 and other ones with even higher view ranges. But WG cannot touch them! And if view range for those ones will stay the same, they will become Mega-OP. And if they will attempt to nerf all prem tanks too, the rage and whine will explode, and they just can’t afford that at all in current situation.

    So, I really hope, devs will come to their minds about this..

  18. WTF E100 Had been nerfed enough….
    I know it’s so _____ to get clipped on and I have been rebalanced multiple times, but currently if you get spotted, Literally EVERYONE just stop what they do and shoot the hell out of you.
    The only thing keeping it alive currently is that it had VR and the Fear factor of it. I think if this nerf will apply on WTF E100, It shouldnt be as harsh as the others, same goes to it’s entire line.

  19. Another way to fuck up the game.
    So TD’s all get majorly fucked over twice in a row, and we still have cunting REMF parties 1 shotting all over…. Any TD that doesn’t have armour is totally fucked.. they cant even hide behind a mountain like the coward bastards in SPGs…

    What is the point of a Tank Destroyer then??

    The clue is in the fucking name!!

      • every second match. sometimes when lucky, Im left with something like 10-20 hitpoints.

        I dont think he was talking about tier X TDs with armor and 2000 health.

        There are TDs with 300-400hp and 300viewrange already. Add the fact camo afetr shooting was nerfed and the fact that 9 out of 10 LTs are useless suiciders.

    • pretty much this is how I feel.

      I dont have any of those high tier TDs, the highest tier I got is Jpanther.
      But I like playing hetzer, stug, hell even jpzIV.
      If they nerf viewrange on these as well, those tanks are useless.
      right now, hey nerfed camo.
      So what do we have here ?
      30mm armor, 350hp, 135 alpha, and 310 viewrange (which might change to what? 250 ? kidding me? My granddad has better viewrange.)

      • every second match?? really??? i cant probably count on 1 hand the amount of times ive been ONE SHOTTED this year. but i know how many times a wanker in his invisi td has reduced my hp by 700-1200 with one shot

        • That’s because you’re most likely a extremely shit player that “guards arty” in his top tier HT, then drives out in the open.

          P.S.: Do you also turn your side armor to the “bush wanker” after he shaved off 700-1200 of your HP?
          P.P.S.: CONFIRMED Terrible E-100 driver

        • @Ste Mitchell

          I’m not playing tier 10 TDs. Im not talking about those OP shits.
          Im tlking about tier 4-6 tank destroyesrs which will most probably be nerfed as well just because tehy are the same class as 183, wtf100, etc..

          Im playing StuG. = 135 aplha. 350hitpoints. and a solid 40mm armor,
          If top tier, only KV-1S can oneshot me Everything else needs 2 shots. When on bottom, EVERYTHING can do that. While Im trying to hurt them with my 135 alpha and not be seen at the same time.

          • marder 38 t is soo op………….its only td i play…..and i think its completely op only bad part is the amount of ammo it can carry, cant count the amount of times ive ran out of ammo in it

            • Marder 38 is NOT op. It’s a good TD, but FAR from OP.

              “its only td i play” – hence your general ignorance & retarded/idiotic comments.

              • Marder III/ 38(t) is somewhat OP, because you can smack-up the inexperienced players on lower tiers with a skilled crew, the good view range, great gun arc, ROF, aim time, accuracy, decent alpha and speed – quite a lot of good and greats. As top-tier you can even lead the charge at maps like Prokhorovka.

            • hapepns a lot in Stug 3 G .. 35shells.
              but this nerf might fix it. I will have to be so close i will get killed before I run out of ammo.

      • I don’t buy your complaints.
        1) It’s not certain that WG nerfs the lower-tier viewranges to the same extent like the higher tiers.
        2) You will get Sixth Sense by default.
        3) Circular rende range will likely come too and ease the pain of edge-of-the-box sniping.
        4) Accuracy is likely to be nerfed as well.
        The latter maybe some patches later, but there’s some hope that everything fits together.
        5) Hetzer, Stug, JPz4 and JPanther are pretty bouncy. You can also reverse 15m from the bush before you shoot. You can switch position or at least angle them a little after shooting (works well with the russian casemate-TD’s).
        If you sit on a hill or open ground in the only bush available with uncovered sides and no hard cover nearby – you playing it wrong.
        If you need the viewrange of the aforementioned TD’s to spot your targets by yourself – you playing it wrong.
        If you go toe-to-toe with russian brutes – you playing it wrong !

        One-shotted every 2nd game ? Seriously, if at that point half of your team is still alive – see above.

        Sure, Kolobanov’s and De-Langlade’s will be harder to get for TD’s. But it’s a good message for all the low-health meds and heavies who took the effort to work off the opposing team just to get finally annihilated by the magic camping fairy …

      • I’m surprised if it wouldn’t get nerf. It’s sick right now.

        Seriously, I grinded T49 so fast with it that it was not even funny. T49 would feel so useless and boring without it’s derpyderpy-cannon after that.

        If one nerf is justified it is one on Bulldog.

        • Can’t remember any. I assume it’s either nerf on mobility or gun.

          Or bit on both. Snip off some hp/t from engine or nerf terrain resistance a bit. Nerf pen slightly and ROF.

          Small adjustments would be the best…but knowing WG they might make it unplayable just as sure.

          • The T49 first gun is weird… the range of damage rolls is so extreme….

            So many games I can see 5 shots make 20-50 dmg, then the next 5 do 500-800 each…

            Its not RNG… its FRNG

                • Then you’re either hitting a target just after enemies do, because the game will for some mysterious reason add the numbers up, getting ammoracks and engine fires, or you’re seeing things that aren’t there. Since 320*1,25=400.

          • I’m putting my money on the ground resistance and maybe traverse. It’s insanely mobile compared to it’s predecessor and descendant for absolutely no reason. T49 is the same tank, just with a different turret, but for some reason M41 WB has like 40% better terrain stats and I think it’s become pretty clear that it doesn’t need that.

            The engine won’t be touched, I think. AFAIK it’s historical, plus it shares the engine with T49 and T49 doesn’t need a mobility nerf.

              • Magic. Specifically, the magic of “shooting HE and hitting but not penetrating”. Which is not really magic at all, I suppose.

                • Pretty much this. The standard ammo is HESH/HEP, which is basically just HE. If it doesn’t pen, it deals halved damage (further reduced by armour thickness).

                • I do think there’s something screwy on this first gun… the amount of times I shoot a low armour rear end and don’t pen (supposed to be 100mm) but then i can shoot head on thru 200mm…. .

                  Probably just RNG² x HE³….

  20. I just wonder what class will become useless next.

    Arty is pretty much unplayable. its just pure frustration to wait 50 seconds for reload and then fully aimed it misses.

    TDs will now be blind. Sure 400m is way OP. But nerfing viewrange for WHOLE CLASS is just stupid. They can as well remove guns compeltely on TDs tier 3-6. Shooting is basically suicide. Not worth to get spoted and onshot for the 150alpha damge done by first shot you fire. then you are oneshot because of no armor and 350hp.

    • You shit up games in arty, so you switched to TDs. You now can’t shit up games in TDs so looks like you’ll just have to play a real tank and get shit on for being the bad player that I suspect you are.

      No more using WG’s bad decision making as a crutch.

      • Really ?

        I got ONE! arty – amx 13f3 which I unlocked from 12t. 950 alpha. Thats same as KV-2 (same tier, kv2 has even faster reload) yet you dont insult KV-2 drivers.

        I like TDs, true. I dont have ANY tier 8+ TD.
        I drive Stug, JpzIV, Jpanther, and churchill GC.

        Now, PLEASE! Explain me how am I fucking up your games at tier 6 when driving these vehicles?

    • I can see it now:
      Blind Stug III / AT-2 / cannot out-spot KV-1
      Even more super blind SU-85 cannot spot anything till it’s right under it’s gun
      Ultra blind unplayable Hetzer, cannot spot anything until it drives into it.

      I just hope this effects the TD’s with retarded viewranges (waffles) more than the lowertier ones, especially since a lot of tier 2-4 ones aren’t good to begin with.

      • It’s OK, dude, according to 133t players like Ste Michell all TDs are OP and should be nerfed to oblivion…

        • couldnt agree more m8 – presuming you want td’s nerfed because you spend all you time driving them and cant find a way to break your addiction?

          • I started this game (2 years ago) playing mostly TDs without having any actual idea of how & what the meta for TDs is. I just liked the idea of an unseen assassin, using stealth & long range to wipe out its targets when used correctly.

            Now, not only have TDs received a camo nerf (camo after firing) but now 99% of the maps are utter SHIT for Tank Destroyers, because there are literally NO sniping areas, almost all maps have been turned into retarded corridor slugfests!

            Rule of thumb for TDs: once spotted, you’re dead. With the only exceptions of some Tier 9 & 10 TDs, that have really strong frontal armor, basically ALL Tank Destroyers rely on NOT BEING SPOTTED.

            But fine, let’s kill off a ENTIRE TANK CLASS because absolute retarded rejects like you can’t roam in Hevi Tonks everywhere on a map without being owned by anyone with a bit of skill

            • the last part also applies on arties.
              Im terrible arty player, got only one vehicle. But i can see when my prey is good or bad player.

              good players use cover, relocate. I cant even aim properly.
              Bad players sit on the same spot like idiots, while my 3 shots miss them really close. Suddenly 4th shot (2 minutes later) kill them and they rant “omg op skycancer” …. Sure OP.. he knew I was firing at him , had 2 minutes to move and didnt. And now arty is OP.

              • Mate, I was finished off by a UK Tier 8 sky cancer in my STA-1 some good 15 seconds after I was spotted cresting a ridge. I backed up in a curb, switched directions and started advancing in a whole other directions… but that bloody cancer still got me.

                No, arty is still way too good at hitting moving targets.

                • try to play it. its purely random. I had a couple of shots like this, then again I cannot count shots that miss when fully aimed…

                  I can as well say… man I got oneshot in my leopard 1 by tier 8 STA-1. he fired one shot on the move, hit my ammorack and I was dead. STA-1 is TOO OP, nerf it to the ground I say….

                • That’s pure luck and such a single incident stings but is no base for a proper judgement.
                  I once one-shot-torched an AT2 30secs into the battle by blind-firing into the usual approach lane at Karelia/Assault. He will surely never forget that. It’s very dirty, but there are hundreds oft misses and low-dmg splashes on the other side …

            • I agree, I only have 2 TDs in my garage these days and I keep them because one is the E25. Otherwise I will not have any TDs whatsoever. Btw, is there any bush in the new Stalingrad map for my scouts? :-)

              This map is the ‘corridor’ dream.

      • I think the nerf will mostly hit higher tiers, and on lower tiers only the extremes like SU-85B and Alecto.

  21. They should provide API for spotting damage instead. Many people doesn’t like to play LT because of wn8 (or play them in different way – for damage, not for spot)

    • Some of them are meant to be played that way.

      ELC AMX is basically a TD. Terrible viewrange, even worse signal range. Good alpha.

      I always giggle when team is asking me “ELC go spot you noob”
      Yeah right :D I will spot, If I see anything, you wont know about it anyway becase of my poor radio…

      • … it’s now available.. but Stats Monkeys haven’t included it yet…

        They will more than likely have to redo the entire shitty WN for this…

        They can’t “just do LTs” because some other tanks are ace for spotting and would skew the results by miles.

        If they have any balls, they will publish a section where players can see the full effect on their “stats” as a Before and After column….

      • Actually in the game your and your teammate’s radio ranges sums up. Don’t ask me why…

        So in ELC your effective communication range is around 900-1100 meters, cause you teammates have much better radios. Considering spotting range, it is more than enough in most cases, apart maybe from extreme scout-arty comm on some maps.

      • Bad view range but has the best camo rate in the game, use its low profile and speed in active scouting.

          • no, camo is great!
            Im not saying its bad… im saying it does better as a TD not a scout.
            At least for me, I can carry game when playing TD mode. When just scouting, I have to rely on team to do damage.. and we know how this usually goes…

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  23. Is it just me or have none of the people who whine about “suicide scouts” or “YOLOrushers” ever actually seen how scouts played in pre-physics WoT?

    Usual strategy for scout back then was to rush through enemy lines and kill artillery (before any nerfs they were really really accurate and deadly) before dying. That was bit dump strat back then but effective if player had T-50-2 and could just dodge everything (did that so many times, strike in, dodge all the heavy tanks and their shells and disappear to other side of map).

    I honestly can’t say that there are so many scout rushers in these days. Back then pre-sphycis it was a fact in every single match. Now idiots play lights (especially mid tier scouts MT, VK and Chaffee) as meds or heavy and die because they get shot. Actual “noobrush” I’ve seen only few times and by really, really bad players/bots.

    But overall, nice rebalancing (won’t call it a nerf since TD that can see half a map is not balanced) and I think it will bring more tactical sense into games.

    • That was the usual strategy for shitters, pretty much the same strategy that shitters use now.

      Back then sure, a T-50-2 might make it through to kill the arty, but most of the time the shitlords just got the scout medal and died in the first 30 seconds.

      I cannot tell if you are seriously advocating “YOLO rushing” the arty in an M24 Chaffee or not? That tank is the size of a house and back then had the worst top speed of the tier 5 lights.

      Chaffee was always meant to be played like a mini-medium, and now all LTs have been “re-orientated” into this role.

    • “won’t call it a nerf since TD that can see half a map is not balanced”

      SU 85B says Hello.
      Almost any tier 4-6 TD says hello….

      nefing whole class just because tier 8-10 is broken is stupid.

  24. Because this is just a basic statement, not detailed, my opinion will be limited to only think about: what happens to other tanks? TDs get a view range nerf, so rely on a signal range, which will still be 700ish, therefore, staying back and shoot is how they will win their game. Adding to the signal range comes a light, or even a medium, as I would support both keeping their view range in order to do the passive scouting, as well scouting individually for the lights. Heavies might keep theirs as well or get limited by 10-20 so they get a more up front part of dealing damage close, while tanking for bullets as well. I think I will like this gameplay if it works out, but since random battles are very random, a TD might get butthurt because there will not be any spotting done for longer than 1 minute. I might agree with that too. So, binocs are probably mandatory for TDs then. I can see this happen

    • Lights: 400-420m range
      Mediums: 380-400m
      Heavys: 360-380m
      TDs: 340-360m
      SPG: 300m

      That would be enough.

      • Perfect, indeed.
        Though the UK/Murica medium line’s probably deserve slightly better viewrange because of their god awful camo, since they’re easily outspotted by lights even now. I’m going by the action X of course, not the current very fake tier 10 medium for the british SPG’s deserve bad viewrange, having some of them be able to reliably defend themselves from up close, even if from TD’s is just wrong and just places the emphasis on turreted SPG’s even more than already. ( because turreted SPG’s are pretty much the most reliable and playable SPG’s currently )

      • U dont know what u talking about. Tell me, how taller tank see less?Mause see more than all soviet MD, and LT. ITS LOGIC!!!!!!!!!! WG logic. This is stupid like hell, and tell t34 drivers, that 360 m view range, what they will have. NOOBS. Can’t kill TD, l2p.

        • The whole issue with the balancing is that is fucking outdated. The general balancing ideas worked back in the days when there were no fucking tier 10 TDs and mediums and when most of the tanks were from the WW2, from the time where the tiger II and is3 were the only heavys having 225mm pen and armor that could bounce if enemies “snapshot”. From the time where there were max 1-2 TDs per side and where at tier 9 only the obj 704 and JT existed as TDs, and when people playing tier 10 were alot less (making tier 8 end up in tier 10 much less) and where gold ammo was for gold and not credits. Then it made sense to have the balance as it were. But since then, alot has changed making most tanks useless, other than some few (which can be seen looking at global WR).

  25. Ok now it makes more sense on why to give those new TDs such low viewrange. Maybe WG listened to my suggestion (nerfing some other classes viewrange too). But it will bring “unintended consequences”, currently most top tiers have a viewrange of around 400 meters, so if 1 team has 3/4 of tank destroyers and a bad scout it will be in massive viewrange disadvantage, so there might be some room for balancing number of tank destroyers in both teams to at least +-2.

    • Any tank sitting behing 1-2 bushed or sniping from hardcover/hull down positions are an issue in WOT and always had been. This effectively means they limit the movement of enemy tanks and punish dynamic players. A camping is3 and is6 is the same shit as a camping ferdinand or amx 48, they make 400-500 damage with 0 risk getting damaged in return. Same shit, different cowards.

      I support the view range nerf because it would encourage people to move closer to the battle, which makes sense with the more “corridor friendly” maps, how ever keeping the same render range is fail, and will make the camping worse. Here is where WG is failing big time. Sniping can be done on corridior maps as well, just hide your hull behind a soild cover.

  26. i think we should remove or fix the camouflage and spotting system rather than the other it’s really fruastrating when the enemy that in front of you suddenly dissappear or continue firing near your without being spot also LT should not get any 100% camo alltime it’s camo should work like other class except it’s have highest spot range and also reduce enemy camo by 50% this should encourage ppl to scout run plus it should make camping less useful

    • I already use binocs on some artys, but after TD viewrange nerf it could be even more useful to hunt down the last (and blind) enemy TD ;)

  27. I can’t say I don’t like this. Had my frustrations when I get spotted and killed by TDs when I’m trying to scout. This would reduce that happening, that’s pretty good.

    TDs have always been the tank-with-big-gun, I personally think it’s fair to let them depend on the team to spot since they have big guns, probably good camo, and half the time they are sitting further back than the HTs/MTs. They don’t really need that spotting range since the team should be spotting for them, the same for arty(current arties are pretty much blind on their own from my experience, and even if they spot an enemy coming for them, they will probably miss their shot if they’re reloaded). Though, the view range nerf might be a little too much, maybe the maximum they can get is 400m?

    • “They don’t really need that spotting range since the team should be spotting for them”

      Except that 90% of the teams are complete and utter wastes of oxygen and I have won games by spotting my own targets & invisi-sniping in my TD when the rest of my shitlords were doing nothing or were camping their assess off.

      As of now, I can’t even do that because the maps have been turned into slugfests & corridors, removing almost all long-range engagements.

    • Err, tanks sitting back and NOT spottimg themselves or trying to move closer to spot arew the issue. I dont see how the problem with “invisisnipers” will be solved by making LT have better view range. Keeping the same render range is bullshit because many TDs and other campers alreaddy render-snipe as it is. Sure the accuracy in future will be nerfed little, but still be alot better than pre 8.6 = you WILL get hit by 500-2000 dmg from 500 meter and similar from render-snipers.

  28. I’m going to make a bet they will nerf it like this: T67 370m -> 300m but SU-85 280m -> 270m.

  29. Finally, I’ve been waiting for this for so long. Even more after the arty nerf, since less people play arty the role of LTs grew even weaker. I’m really looking forward to this, and might even start playing WoT again, just because of this balancing feature!

    • you know next class to nerf wil be HTs or meds, right ?

      lets find 1-2 OP Heavies and nerf ALL HTs.

    • If this change is implemented, I see a nerf coming to all the new scouts in the game. They are fun to drive now and in many circumstances OP — the M41 is probably the best medium in its tier. I hope they realise they cannot touch the view range of vehicles, it is just such a critical aspect to the current game play, if they do so, we will probably see the biggest game change so far. And that might trigger big re-balancing changes for many patches.
      Just change some skills for scouts — the community has already indicated what to do.

      • Problem is, by making LT king of view range campers will benefit because they can now just render-snipe. Campers and LT goes hand in hand, because these vehicles are designed to play like this. I personly think all tanks should be able to move and engage enemies on their own terms, not be forced to stay stil because they cant see a shit.

        This nerf woul only be good if:

        1. All tanks would ger view range nerfed, also scouts
        2. Nerf render range so nobody can explot scouts and snipe over the view/spotting range.

        Would this make LT/scouts useless…yes it would. Would it encourage dynamic gameplay..yes it would.

  30. I’ve seen so many rounds with my team going bananas again, dying within 2 minutes and leaving me in my medium tank against 4 or 5 camping TDs. You have literally no chance when those camping players will just keep sitting somewhere. One spots you with his insane view range and binoculars and deals 850 damage while you can’t even see him because of his magic camo and another camper finishes you off 2 seconds later.

    With guns dealing such insane amounts of damage the TDs are killers as long as the team numbers are even. When your team is losing, you can still deal those massive damage shots with almost guaranteed penetration. And if you got binoculars, you can as well deal damage without even getting spotted with that insane camo values.

    But still, I am usually raging a lot more about artillery than about TDs, because artillery is just cowardly and takes practically no skill. I tried artillery a couple of times, went up to tier 6 and did not enjoy it at all. I felt cheap to be honest, sitting in a 100% safe position and dealing killer damages including oneshots. Position yourself smartly in the beginning of the round (that’s what the majority of arty players can’t do at all), aim, click, wait, aim, click, wait… Duck Hunt on the NES requires more skill than that.

    • ‘” with his insane view range and binoculars and deals 850 damage while you can’t even see him”

      yes, 310 view range, 135 alpha is just too OP for some TDs, lets nerf these as well. you know, these are TD class as well…

  31. As I always say, this game will become World of Retarded R+M1 heavy tanks. Trash players always wins in this game.

    • Hmm, only some heavys are noob friendly which usualy are those with high alpha and bouncy armor, mainly kv1s, IS, is3, is6 etc. I just live it when a 122mm gun overmatch my turret roof on my tiger II by snapshotting…great balance. Now these campers can thrive even more, just camp and snipe with 0 risk beeing spotted in return.

  32. good idea,.. being in a tier7-8 light is just playing a bait, distracting a noob e100, so my team can shoot it…but here goes a batchat with epic burst fire, 60 speed, low profile high viewrange, and does everything better than i could do in a 1390..

    • The problem here is the Overpowerful MT at higher tiers.
      This is not a LT problem.

  33. i think it s pretty simple give td 2 view range one moving one stationary , make the same for heavy , leave medium as they are , increase LT view range and make 2 radio range one moving one stationary for all but LT , and done.

      • but its more realistic , radio had less range when moving and you surely didnt see very well over 100′s of meter when moving trough perioscope and viewport . they can put for once a solution that is closer to reality and make the game better

  34. I have more than 8k matches in lights and I think this nerf will break the game. Vision range is a critical aspect in this game, touch it and you are in big trouble, to say the least. A change like this would require huge testing effort.
    The community has already indicated other ways to improve the scout role within the game which might benefit enough pure scouting drivers without causing so much disruption to other type of tanks. WG should implement changes of these sort very gradually — 25% decrease in view range is far too much.
    Also, new scouts are the best mediums around these days, improving their view range capabilities will make them super OP.

    • Well, put is like this, the Bulldog can from 300-400 meters pen a tiger II in the lowe plate while beeing angled, time after time after time staying invisible. In my book, something is wrong if a tier 7 light can brutalise majority of tier 8 heavys frontaly. Just my 2 cent. The new lights/scouts are too strong compared to same tier mediums.

  35. If there isn’t a universal VR nerf along with this one, the camping meta will be enforced even harder by TDs. Why would you ever move your TD when it can get out-spotted by tanks 3-4 tiers below it?

    Keep in mind that nothing prevents you from render range sniping anyway, the nerf only means that you WILL get outspotted if you move.

    • ^THIS!

      I used to carry the idiots in my team with TDs with good/very good view range, since the bloody idiots didn’t know how to spot for shit

      Not to mention I get way better XP than waiting for some idiot siemka to spot tanks in front of me. No thanks, I can and want to do that myself, when possible!

      But noooo… TDs are OP, they shoot and pen us!

      Fucking retards completely ruining the game!

      • Exactly, nerfing view range and keeping the SAME render range will only benefit campers, because these pussies dont spot themselves anyways. And no corridor maps are not an issue, there are plenty of hard cover that you can hull down/hide behind.

    • So the solo campers will have less impact on the game while the tds who were supporting their team will be unaffected, what is your point?

      • My point is that people who are camping should not be benefited in any case. How ever this view range nerf is still bullshit because they keep the render range the same….these “spot pls mi TD yu hewi” will still be able to bush wank and shoot enemies from their invisible locations.

        A way to really reduce camping is to reduce render range, because then nobody can see enemies outside their view range/spotting range.

  36. OK, corridor maps, shifting balance from heavy to mediums and now a spotting range nerf?

    I mean, does WG want me to stop playing the game? OK I Will !

    I mean, snapshotty medium tanks now have even less trouble hunting me down and swarming me.

    Well, we will where this is going. Had some great TD grinds in mind for this winter but maybe WG just shot me in the back.

    (oh yes, and this: they gotta rebalance this somehow if they are serious about it, I mean, for example, buff the speed of TD’s (make it more a MT))

  37. Fully agree. I mostly play TD’s and with the camo nerf, the bush camo nerf, and now the fucking VR nerf its obvious WG want to fuck TD players in the ass. There are now hardly any maps you can play in a WT100 and not get spotted very quickly, and the move to corridor maps just made this worse.

    As soon as AW becomes available I will be moving.

    • imho problem with WTF100 wanst its camo, or damage.. it was its healthpool.
      1v1 it can empty whole clip in you before you reload 3rd shot (6-7sec on average)
      You are dead and your 2 shots left him with 60% health…

      • Yes. But as it has 0 camo and is usually spotted as soon as it fires the first shot, usually there are more than just one enemy that then target it (usually – all of the enemy)

      • Don’t know about you, but my WTF100 always has atleast one bounce/richochet on the clip of 5 AP shells.
        That still leaves a minimum of 4 x ~550 HP of DMG = 2200.
        But somehow, without APCR that is, I never seem to be able to do exactly that amount of damage per clip.

        And it’s camo is just 0/zero/nada. Which is a bit of a let down, coming from WT auf PzIV or even the supercamo Rhm.

  38. Lel, they haven’t thought this through.

    1)What about premium tanks? Are they prepared for the shitstorm that would hit them if they dared to touch those as well? I would instantly demand all my gold/money back, maybe even sue them for fraud, because according to my countries and EU law they can’t just go around changing goods/services I have paid for without offering a refund.
    Bit overreacting, but still ;)

    2)What about other classes? It would be pretty damn retarded if a tomato in his hurr-durr heavy could spot me before I spot him.

    3)What happens when the tomato suicide scouts all die? Everyone will just camp and call each other noobs for not spotting anything.

    But I guess with the recent trend of corridor maps and the accuracy nerf WG just wants to make the game easier for complete retards. I’m calling it now, after the view range and accuracy nerf they will nerf meds (and the high tier meds actually deserve a nerf) and then we will have tomato IS-7′ s just shooting each other from 50m all day, every day.

  39. Some more info ’bout nerf from Russia. On our part of WoTforums all messages with such info got deleted in ~30 minutes

  40. The only thing they should do is making bigger maps , and extend the maximum spotting range of light tanks on those maps

    • Big maps is not a good idea either since there are massive differances between mobily of the tanks as it is. Even now days, slow tanks really struggle to get from point A to point B.

      All these problems are due to the fact that most tanks that have been introduced the last years differ too much from the older tanks in beta. More tanks with better guns, in terms om pen, accuracy, aimtime and damage as well as more mobile tanks from the 50-70s as well as more high tier mediums and TDs makes the situation absurd.

      I understand maps seem “small” for tanks doing 50-70 km/h and have 40 degrees traverse and shit, but these are mediums and light tanks. The old slowe heavys with mediocre armor are alreaddy victims.

  41. This is dumb I don’t like it, and FIY I don’t play many TDs these days….. TDs will camp even more, even in super OP LT tomato idiot will suck, so what’s the point.

    • True, this will benefit campers alot more since they dont spot themselves anyways. Now any noov camper can be even more invisible, just rely on a scout and stand in the open and shoot with much less risk of getting spotted by enemies.

  42. As the great most of LT driving are suicide idiots dying in first 90 seconds we will have really “great” battles :/

  43. Yet another of WG “brilliant” ideas. They nerf xp rewards for damage over a distance to next to nothing for all tanks which made no sense and only penalized tanks that can’t brawl (not only TDs but tanks with no mobility and/or armor), then they change all maps to corridors again hitting mainly long range tanks and now they will nerf view range. No one at WG has at least 2 cells to realize that it will cause even more camping. Arties spam is guaranteed cause they won’t be affected by view range nerf. And guess what, remember how 50+ tones of steel were disappearing in the middle of the open field at ~400 meters distance ? Well, they will now disappear at 300 meters. It would at least make some sense if they had finally introduced that mechanics keeping tanks spotted until line of sight is broken. But as in everything else by WG its ETA is Soon TM

    • View range nerf would be good, if they would nerf the render range or what ever they call it. Even if view range/spotting range is nerfed, people will still be able to see tanks 500-600 meters away and snipe, and this is wrong. This nerf will affect everybody but camping bushwankers (since they dont spot themselves anyways). They only way to remove camping in terms of nerfing view range is to nerf the distance other tanks can be visible.

      So basicly, nerfing view range to make light superior will benefit only artys, TD and campers. Not those who move on the battlefield and engaging the enemy themselves.

  44. Well, something needs to be done. I love playing light tanks. But for the most part, they are dominated by mediums who for the most part can do 90% of the job better. Which would you rather have on your team? An RU251 or a T54? They both get the same matchmaking after all.

    My original though was to give lights something in addition to the retaining camo on the move, and that was ignoring camo or part of it from the other side. This would allow them to spot opposing TDs the T54 couldn’t, while retaining view ranges.


    If they nerf view ranges across the board while retaining it for lights, this effectively accomplishes the same thing. Camo is a function of terrain and vehicle modifiers to reduce the view range, so this may work.

  45. The problem is that if they nerf viewrange of all tanks, you have to basicly come even closer to these invisicampers to spot them. I think they overnerfed the view range to be honest. And once again, having the same render range is bullshit. This wont affect TDs and campers spo much since they dont spot objects themselves anyways. Making scouts more valuble in terms of view range encourage people camping and not moving, I mean why should they when they can just stand back and point and click.

    • No, with this you will be able to get closer to the invisicamper before he spots you ….

      There is no real problem with tds camping using others spotting anyway, that is their job. By default they are shooting enemies that their team is engaging. It is the tds that huddle at the bottom corner (like 1 line on prohkarovka) of the map away from the decision points that matter.

      They can spot for themselves currently so they will sit and wait for one tomato heavy to stumble out in the open and kill him doing nothing else all game. Once they are unable to spot for themselves they have the choice of staying where they are and dying or moving to a position to support the actual fights that matter (6,7,0 lines on prohkarovka) on the other side of the map where their team battling over the bottleneck is spotting for them.

      Meanwhile that open area which was previously locked down by tds (1,2,3 lines on prohkarovka) is now a happy play ground for lights and mediums to flank the main decision points or feast on the blind tds that kept trying to camp.

      • A TD behind a bush will always spot you sooner no matter what even if they nerf view range. The abilty to not see those TDs are the issue. I would be fine with this nerf is TDs were the ones that would get nerfed only. Also speaking about tomato heavys, you need to move and take risk in making damage, not just play passive. If I wouldnt take risk an play slightly agressive I would never benefit. Sure I could play like a sniper heavy which many people are doing but at the end opf the day they are sub 50% Wr players with 1300 avr dmg in a tiger II. This is not how you play. I say nerf view range and render range (so people cant render-snipe, which imo is the core problem of the gem).

  46. Just great another nerf to TD’s!
    This should just about kill off the user base for world of nerfs, they should fire storm before he screws up the game anymore. Can’t wait for armored warfare to come online.

    • Err, majority of TD players dont spot themselves anyways. Also less TDs are always better, before 8.6 there were like 1-2 TDs max and they were overall not popular. Now they are 1/3 of all tanks in the queue more or less. Im not sure the increasement in TDs has done ahything good for the gameplay, combined with the accuracy buffs.

    • Why rip? How many of these TDs spot themselves now days anyways? Only differance will be that engagements will be closer, TDs will still spot mediums and heavys sooner, because they have better base camo and camo net, skill and binos.

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  48. Here’s an idea… make the maps f**king bigger so you can stop making up these bulls**t inaccurate view ranges for tanks that had ranges 10 times what you’re giving us. Spreading the teams out in areas with a lot more real-estate will dramatically improve light-tanks performance since they’re not running around trying to scout in a pathetic containment area.

    • How will bigger maps solve the current camping and invisisnipe problems? As long as people stay back behind hard cover and bushes and shoot without taking any risk getting shot back the game will be crippled.

  49. I’m all for the view range Nerf on TD’s would like to see view range on heavy’s be Nerfed was well will give lt and med more rolls to play and better chance to survive would really cut down on the TD/Hvy snipe camping from 400+ meters away and probably make CW more interesting

    • TDs and heavys are not the same, TDs alreaddy have better base camo to beginn with, plus camo skill, net, paint and binos as well as generaly better accuracy, damage and pen. TDs will always outsnipe any class in the game. Problem is the classes we know about since the beta has changed alot, that is why the way tanks and jechanics are balanced must change. WG mentioned specialy they wanted to make fighting distance longer in 8.6 what is why they increased accuracy and nerfed bushes little = tanks spotted on longer distance. Now WG said they will shorten the fightning distance. They need to make up their fucking mind.

      • OR POSSIBLY LEARN WHERE THE BADDIES CAMP AND DONT GET SHOT BY THEM WHEN YOU ARE LIT…and this nerf wont stop camping or 400+ meter sniping…if they have medium tanks spotting for them you will still get rekted by invisible camping tds…and dude medium tanks are super powerful already they dont need a buff by a view range nerf on other tanks

  50. I’m so glad I didn’t buy that jt88 that’s been promoted lately. Thank you WG for saving me money!

    • Lol….render range is the issue dawg. Im not sure what WG wants here, to me it is apparent they will buff the LT branch to make it more popular and make ppl spend gold to grind it. Making view range nerf still keeping the render range will do nothing to prevent camping.

  51. Not really fond of this idea. What about tanks which are meant to be snipers? Brawler tanks will win far more of this nerf. Also this nerf requires having equal amount of LT-s per team and they better be equal in tiers too. Far better would be to increase LT view range or LT-s can have better max spot range than other classes.

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  53. why not just make it that bushes don’t help TDs as much as other classes?

    I agree with TD view range nerf but that won’t matter as WG fucked up all the maps for LTs anyway as to where heavies/everyone else will spot people 200M away while low armor tanks get very little time to actually shoot enemies without retaliation.

    • The tanks that actually can rely on armor in wot are minority dude, so your argument is invalid. On the other hand, most low armored targets have better guns with more pen just so they can…..yeah right neglate heavily armored targets. As long as high pen guns and TDs and arty exist in game, armor doesnt mean a shit more or less. Also dont forget gold ammo, which also shot on armor.

  54. ARE U FUCKING KIDDING ME….so the baddie whine has won out again to make WG go and do something completely unnecessary and harmful to this game!!!!! I like to play my tds aggresivly and now I will be completely screwed thanks to all you camping fags who play tds all day and nothing else…and also to light tank drivers who whine about getting blown off the map cause they are fucking retards who dont know how to scout tds properly…..WAT is complete camo on the move not good enough for scouts….I play lots of scouts and I never once thought that a nerf to view range would ever be a good idea it is completely unnecessary and I am so fucking sick of WG messing with the mechanics of this game when its working perfectly fine…pointing as well at possilbe accuracy “nerf” or in other words adding more RNG to accuracy SUCH A GOOD WG LETS ADD MORE RNG TO THIS GAME….btw thanks for the completely unnecessary buggy patch you just gave us I am so happy you are intent on ruining your game cause you are doing a good job

  55. Bottom line people need to learn to play their tanks…not whine on the forums for a crutch to help replace skill in this game…after they do the same thing for the 10th time and guess what same thing happened they got wrecked cause they dont learn from their mistakes…yeh I am raging i know but i dont give a shit

  56. And this also makes us more dependent on MM not screwing us over by giving the other team 2 scout tanks and the other team none…It will also make a whole team much more reliant on the scouts on their team to know what they are doing and light for the team….COMMON more often then not scout drivers get over whelmed about being 3 tiers lower and will just camp somewhere completely inneffective to the team cause REASONS???? I dont ever trust my scouts to spot properly for me…in almost every tank I play I do my own spotting rarely do I have a scout on my team who knows how to spot properly

  57. WOT will be broken if they make teams reliant on a certain role of tanks to do something like spotting it just wont work…in a perfect world where everyone knew how to play it would work…but we dont live in a perfect world and you cannot put the responsibility of spotting for a entire team into the hands of 1-3 random lt drivers….thats my opinion and im sticking to it

    • True…the idea of needing one class to carry the others will only work if there are fixed number of tank classes in each team and where players are equaly competent. In randoms, naa you cant have fun relying on team mates too much. The problem I see with this is that camping will still exist and even become worse because render range will be the same.

  58. they wouldn’t need to nerf TDs had they not fucking killed the T-50 and removed the T-50-2

  59. Making teams rely more on scouts is gonna f**k over a lot of teams when a noob player suiscouts and dies in 1st 30-seconds of a game then team ends up being blind rest of game…GG

  60. Please nerf view range for all tanks as well as render range = people need to get closer to make damage and take more risks. Bye bye bushwankers. Bushwankers, TDs and arty are scum of earth. Pussies.