19.1.2015

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- Jagdpanzer E-100 will not be switched for “something real” – and there is no incentive to do so, the vehicle is fine
- various branches (SS: specifically German TD’s mentioned) will not be reworked in order to have all the vehicles in them with the same playstyle (SS: basically, the player wants to switch the TD’s around so the entire branches get a specific “character” – this will not happen, with existing branches anyway)
- T30 will not be “returned” to the heavy tank branch
- KV-4 will not lose its unhistorical top gun
- why was LT buff done the way it was in 9.6? “No comment”
- tier 8-10 penetrantion nerf of some vehicles was not yet decided (it’s not clear how WG will do it)
- the historicity of gun penetration is less important than the importance of the gun (vehicle) being balance gameplay-wise
- damaging external modules does not count as damage done in battle, only damaging the main tank hitpoints does
- IS-7 has historical armor, E-100 didn’t have a turret in real life and that’s why the turret thickness can be balanced however WG wants, Maus armor is based on research of Yuri Pasholok, who said that the values could be different and 200+
- the FV215b (183) armor buff in 0.9.5 is “based on historicity” (SS: wut?)
- Storm states that a player proposal to reduce scout tank hitpoints while compensating that with improving other characteristics (camo, mobility) would only result in unrealistic (“UFO”) tanks
- the replacement for WT E-100 is not the twin 128mm “Flakzwilling” mount WT
- not only the Waffenträger line has balance problems, the earlier considered “Sturm” TD line (Brummbär and Sturmtiger) has them as well

102 thoughts on “19.1.2015”

    • Well, how about Obj. 268? With its 152mm L/34 howitzer and 303 pen (while the german L/38 only has like 235 pen).

          • Real BL-10 had 244 mm or something but other tier 10 guns are overbuffed, for example German 12,8 cm gun – IRL it was not much an improvement over 8,8 cm KwK 43 (~210 mm), L7 without APCRs would have 210 – 220 mm…
            Still with such caliber (152 mm) you don’t need to penetrate armor to disable a tank so simple nerfing wouldn’t work in game unless non penetrating hits could also deal damage (like HE, but less)…

            And ISU – replace BL-10 with 152 mm BL-8 with 240ish pen (still 750 alpha) and make BL-10 only accessible on 704 (with that BL-8 stock gun).

            Oh and how is KW-4 long 107 mm unhistorical? This gun was actually developed and could be used in super heavies (thy just considered it overkill in 1940).

            • Yeah irl getting hit by a 150mm HE shell would would or kill the entire crew from overpressure.

            • 286mm pen is too much for a tier 8 TD period. In fact if you look at the list I made on tier 8 tanks only a few have extreme pen values. Even tier 10 TDs should not have more than 260-270mm AP pen max, this is more than enoug. I even think that tier 9-10 TDs should have as much AP pen as heavys because those high tier heavys have enough pen to pen all tanks in the game frontaly even while some are angled.

              We must remember than when pen values were defined in WOT there was no normalizations, much worse accuracy and lack of many powerfull tanks. There were limited amount of tanks alltogeather as well as no tier 10 TDs and mediums as well as lack of gold ammo for credits.

    • personally i dont care that much about the meds standard pen but i will say one thing i wish that tanks with guns that have over 255 pen didnt have the option of premium ammo because the amount of full gold t-62as, object 268s (i see this do it the most because yknow 300 pen isnt enough…), t110e5s and t57 heavies ive been meeting lately is insane and also people bitch about full gold e-100s but from my experience i rarely meet full gold e-100s but the others i meet constantly and consistently.

      • wat? full gold T-62A? ok i have 5 HEAT rounds in my T-62A but i never use them its jsut tehre if i ever need them which 264 mm pen is ok and if you didnt know APCR is normal ammo at tier X meds

            • It is I know, but all im saying is that 264-270 APCR pen is roughly equal or better than 258mm AP pen that tier 10 heavys has. I dont agree that tier 10 meds should even have equal pen to tier 10 heavys. But to be fair, it is utter fail to balance standard pen values when gold ammo exist. The reason armor is useless is because of gold ammo, period.

              It is very apparent, nerf standard pen and still allow the gold ammo pen = more pay2win element or pay2progress than ever. This will only increase the usage of gold ammo.

              I would personly wish that they removed gold ammo so tanks beeing in better positions and have superior armor/angling should not get penned. Less well aimed shots and autoaim should not be rewarded like it is now. It was better before when gold ammo cost gold and when superior positioning and aiming was rewarded. it is just fucking stupid that tier 9 and 10 tanks use gold ammo when they have so much AP and APCR pen to beginn with that can pen 100% of al tanks in the game frontaly.

        • Only noob idiots use gold on E100, 235mm pen is enough specialy since you got that monster 750dmg alpha on a heavily armored tenk. I have 320 mil credits and I never use gold and I dont need it. Gold ammo ruin the game, period. Only a shame that it is giving so much income that is is not viable to nerf/remove it from game. Why would you even need gold ammo when you have 235mm pen? Only a few tanks you cant pen easily in tier 10 like Maus, E3/E4 and angled IS7. But then again you can always use the stock gun with 246mm pen and 490 alpha which is decent, 490 alpha is still above the general alpha for tier 10 heavys. People are spoiled.

          • If you want to use the first gun on E 100 you are better off playing E 75 tbh.

            I use gold when I need to use gold to secure a win or secure a good kill. Its a tool like any other in game. I don’t have to like it, but I do want to win.

    • Question is what tier 8 tanks that needs pen nerf? As it is now:

      Heavys:
      IS3 – 225
      KV4- 227
      IS6 – 175
      KV5 – 167
      Tiger II – 225
      VK45 – 200
      Löwe – 234
      AMX 50 100 – 232
      FCM 50 – 212
      T32 – 198
      T34 – 248
      110 – 215
      112 – 175
      WZ 111 – 175
      Caernarvon – 226

      Medium:
      Obj 416 – 201
      T-44 – 175
      Panther 8.8 – 203
      Panther II – 203
      Indien Panzer – 212
      Super Pershing – 170
      Pershing – 180
      T69 – 173
      Type 59 – 181
      T-34-2 – 181
      T-34-3 – 175
      STA-1 – 218

      TDs
      ISU-152 – 286
      SU101 – 219
      Ferdinand – 246
      JPII – 246
      RHM – 246
      T28 – 248
      T28 Prot – 248
      AT15 – 226
      Charioteer – 268
      AMX 48 – 257

      As far as I am concearned only some TDs stand out in terms of pen (ISU, Charioteer, AMX) well as some heavys (T34, Löwe, AMX 50 100) and some mediums (Indien Pz, STA-1).

    • TDS should be the main issue to be resolved. Simply put a nerf of gold and normal rounds is the only way to handle most tanks that have penetration problems. The highest pen cannons won’t see a huge drop in potential, only against the heaviest of armor will the changes be noticeable. Which is pretty important since it makes placement and match-ups more important rather than if your using gold or not.

  3. - the FV215b (183) armor buff in 0.9.5 is “based on historicity” (SS: wut?)

    *My face when I see this*
    I am not an expert, but Still…..?

  5. SSy, you wrote:

    - not only the Waffenträger line has balance problems, the earlier considered “Sturm” TD line (Brummbär and Sturmtiger) has them as well

    Does this mean there will be at least a partial Sturm TD line with Brummbär and other derp TD’s, since you write “has” and not “had”.

    Thanks.

    • they were going to bring sturmtiger in but they couldnt do so because of 380 mm gun is OP

      • Its not OP, they just have no idea how to balance it despite the fact that its easy as fuck. In other words – they refuse to accept the balance that was proposed ten thousand times by playerbase

        Its WG after all

        • some say that stormtested sturmtiger and it killed 3 tanks at one shot Maus E100 IS-4 full health that is how much powerfull 380mm gun can be

        • I just love how people think THEY can do much better than the team working on the game.
          1. “proposed ten thousand times by playerbase”, that does not mean 100% of the player base proposed it, or will like it. There will be more people complaining about a 380 shell than people who are welcoming the idea.

          2. Balancing is not just changing parameters then testing it, you have to compare it with existing game play data, this kind of analyses is not accessible by you.

          • Except the game if far from being any realistic/simulator and basically no one cares. So giving the STiger 380mm launcher 1,2-1,5k dmg, 30-50 second reload and regular armor would give us an TD “arty” piece that can fight in front line. Here you have it, overall balanced

            No one cares how big the gun is and what alpha it should have comparing to 17cm and 183mm. No one.

  7. oh my we are going to get the Jagdpanzer Kanone instead of WTE but the tree can cause problem

    well if they change stuff a bit it would work you know they can make 2 trees from jpanther one of them goes to ferdinand and other goes to new tier 8 tier 9 and tier 10 TD so they only need 3 tanks which tier 10 can be kanone tier 8 can be upgraded E-25
    but tier 9? i dont know

    • gotta say 70 kmh top speed and E-25 ish camo values etc would make this tank OP 50mm at front which isnt too bad 105mm gun would have low damage

      Gun
      -105 mm guns have 320 damage
      -276mm pen
      -6 sec reload
      -0.29 dispersion
      -1.9 aim time
      – -7,+15 elevation arc
      -Gun arc 24 deg
      -Ammo capacity 40

      Armour
      -50mm at front
      -400mm something autobounce mantlet
      -20mm at sides with 5 mm tracks
      -10mm at back

      Maneuverability
      -70kmh top speed(historical)
      -Traverse 44 deg

      Camo
      - Superb statinory
      - Bad after fired
      - Bad on the move

      With new 0.9.6 nerf to view range and to stop this E-90 from being a damn scout it should be 350 something view range

      would this be OP? i tried to balance the tank with not having armour(historical) and having a good gun(also historical) but having bad camo and bad view range tell me what should i change

    • Kanonenjagdpanzer ? Are you high ? Thats basically upgunned and faster Jagdpanzer IV and you want it on tier 10 ? At best it would be tier 8 material if they would give it fake 10.5 PaK 45 L/52

      EDIT: Oh well, not totally fake, it was claimed that it could be rearmed to 105mm gun

      • tier 8 ? are YOU high? that tank has 18 p/w with 70 kmh top speed make it E-25 like(good camo and good view range) and it would be OP whats the diffrence between 4005 stage II and kanone? 4005 stage II gets a big gun with long reload bad camo etc kanone gets good camo with small gun(russian mediums have 320 alpha) and superb gun stats

  8. - T30 will not be “returned” to the heavy tank branch

    Wow…there are people still salty over that? That happened ages ago.

    • I also don’t get why people complain about that when the T30 was built to hunt the German big cats.
      They should complain about the T110E4 that is a clear fake and could be replaced by the T58 (a T57 with autoloader and 155mm gun, the hull being the one of the M103).

      • Who the fuck want a turreted TD with an autloaded 155mm gun? That is 750 dmg x4 on a heavy tank plattform with turret!. Even the regular T57 is a broken POS concept in the game.

        • It’s not 4 rounds it’s 3x 750. Remember, T57 has it’s IRL clip size halved, so would T58 have (6 rounds). They could easily balance it with godawful mobility and slow turret traverse. T57 has barely any armor beside the UFP and around the gun, T58 wouldn’t be any better than that. 4 sec autoloading time, 45 sec reload and 270-ish pen would definetely not be OP.

            • Any gun that is making 750 alpha and has less than 10s reload even at tier to is cancer and should get removed. The idea to have another foch 155 with turret is retarded as hell. Even T57 is cancer, 400×4 and 258mm pen, that is too much and broken mechanic.

              And “ofc” T57 dont have any significant armor, because at tier 9 and 10 tanks have more than enough standard pen to pen anything including the T57 which has 258mm AP pen! Talking about armor still allowing tanks to have so much AP pen and gold ammo is idiotic from the frist place.

        • I agree, autloaders are like cancer and we dont want another autloading TD. No matter how you look upon it even 750×3 and on a heavy tank plattform with turret is too much. Turreted TDs are a pain and broken in design. It is world of tanks, and I really wish TDs and artys alltogeather whould be heaviliy reduced.

  10. KanonenJagdpanzer!!!!!!
    They removed the E25 as a premium.
    But we can have the real E25 as a Tier 10!!!!

    Total Troll for tier 10!!!
    90mm Rheinmetall cannon. For balancing to tier 10.
    270mm pen APCR with 250 avg dmg.
    330mm pen HEAT with 250 avg dmg.
    105mm pen HE with 400 avg dmg.
    20 rounds per minute Plus Rammer, Vents, BIA= 2.48 second reload.
    Ninja Camo. 70 KPH max speed.

    MAKE IT HAPPEN!!!
    KanonenJagdPanzer!!!!!!!!!!

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kanonenjagdpanzer

    • gotta say 70 kmh top speed and E-25 ish camo values etc would make this tank OP 50mm at front which isnt too bad 105mm gun would have low damage

      Gun
      -105 mm guns have 320 damage
      -276mm pen
      -6 sec reload
      -0.29 dispersion
      -1.9 aim time
      – -7,+15 elevation arc
      -Gun arc 24 deg
      -Ammo capacity 40

      Armour
      -50mm at front
      -400mm something autobounce mantlet
      -20mm at sides with 5 mm tracks
      -10mm at back

      Maneuverability
      -70kmh top speed(historical)
      -Traverse 44 deg

      Camo
      - Superb statinory
      - Bad after fired
      - Bad on the move

      With new 0.9.6 nerf to view range and to stop this E-90 from being a damn scout it should be 350 something view range

      would this be OP? i tried to balance the tank with not having armour(historical) and having a good gun(also historical) but having bad camo and bad view range tell me what should i change

      • This could simply be a cut and paste E25 for tier 10.
        It’s historical armor means that any tier 10 HE round could rip it to shreds.
        So it would have to rely on DPM with high pen, Class highest view range, Camo, and Mobility to be able to survive.
        It’s historical gun traverese and elevation and depression are also quite good.

        However, since this insane TD actually exsisted…….

      • OP as hell in the right hands. Just like any other tank in the game.

        The obvious problem with the WTE100 is that it is OP even in the wrong hands.

        • ”Broken in all hands”

          Most autoloaders have temperamental guns to balance them and even that doesn’t make them less wanted. ( Half of the tier 8 heavies being AMX 50 100 in clanwars the other half IS-3′s and batchats + T57 on tier 10 being more common than lot’s of IS-7 )

          Autoloaders in a number of decent hands are just more useful than tanks that can only fire single shots when the player is competent enough unless you are hulldown camping in something like a T-62A but clanwars generally do not favour camping T-62A’s ( and you can still rush them with batchats anyway )

    • I just heard that German Rheinmetall BK 90 gun is basically a copy of American 90mm M36 gun, which happens to have 172/262/45 penetration value in the game.

      However the in-game M36 gun is using some WW2 vintage ammunition (M77) for unknown reason, so modern ammunition should be taken into account when calculating new BK 90 gun’s penetration.

    • Me wants. XD
      Give it 262 APCR pen as standard, with some 330ish HEAT as prem. 240-260 alpha 18-20 rpm and 0.29 acc with 1.5 aimtime. Would wreck everything in the right hands and be useless in the hands of a tomato.

  11. “- the replacement for WT E-100 is not the twin 128mm “Flakzwilling” mount WT”

    Was it confirmed that the WT E-100 is going to be switched to something different?

    My suggestion would be a Waffenträger Panther. It has no armor and no autoloader, fits the line more…

  12. Wasn’t there a JagdTiger proposal with gas turbine engine which would give it incredible (for a JT) power?

  13. - damaging external modules does not count as damage done in battle, only damaging the main tank hitpoints does

    but you still get XP and credits for damaging/destroying modules (AFAIK)

    and dont forget the damage assist bonus when you detrack an enemy tank

  14. WT auf E 100 with twin 128 gun, yes pls (but only for me) ;) 10 shot autoloader stronk balance yes?

    • Maus hull with additional spaced armor and two 2000 hp gas turbine engines and captured and modified IS7 turret with twin 128mm guns with 6 shot clip per gun.

      Gun stats:
      Aim time: 1.9s
      Accuracy: 0.25
      Reload: 2s per gun before next shot.
      Reload drum: 30s
      Alpha: 560
      Pen: 320 apcr (standard), 440 (heat)

      :)

  15. the historicity of gun penetration is less important than the importance of the gun (vehicle) being balance gameplay-wise

    AND THEN THEY SAY THIS

    This-> IS-7 has historical armor <-LOL, E-100 didn’t have a turret in real life and that’s why the turret thickness can be balanced however WG wants, Maus armor is based on research of Yuri

    WG doesnt give a shit about any historical accuracy or inaccuracy they just wanted to make players happy so they buffed the is7 cause it is the most popular t10 heavy tank and they used "historical accuracy" as an excuse… in the end WG doesnt give a shit about HISTOORICAL ACCURACY OR INACCURACY and will do watever the hell they want!!!

    • They do care a little bit about historcial accuracy. Also what is wrong with the E100 I have never understood that either. It has a monster gun with 235mm AP pen which is good for everything.

        • Balance was more important in that case. You really believe a tier 10 heavily armored tank with 750 alpha should have more than 235mm pen? Obj is a TD it should have more pen, but no way should the E100 have more then 235mm pen.

  16. So british Death Star, french autoloader destroyer, su powerbeasts and not to mention russian uber-tank-destroyers stays in game and WT E100 must go although it has more drawbacks as all combined?

    …..

    instead they want a Jagdmaus which is bullshit as well….as if three “mobile” bunkers arent enough

  17. how about replacing WT with Sturmtiger ?!? one is real , the other one isn’t. seems fair enough to me that way no one can whine.

        • A Waffle can pretty much one clip anything including a maus with high rolls anyways. Sturmtiger is worse than it in every single way and literally only has that ridiculous gun going for it.

      • The original gun for the Sturmtiger was supposed to be a short barreled 210mm cannon, of which ingame the GWE-100 already has a long barreled 210mm cannon.

        The 380mm rocket mortar was just what was available after the Reich started to cannibalize the surface portion of the Kriegsmarine.

  18. the main point i wonder is, why tier 10 meds have more penetration than tier 10 heavies? because they dont have more pen. than heavies till tier 9 (some exceptions like centurions sta-1 / type 61 etc.)
    why t62a has 268 pen when the highest pen. on heavies is 258 mm (260 mm on that personel mission award ıs7 clone obj. xxx whatever)

    i mean they dont have to flank you to pen., even a BC25t can sit in front of you and shoots whereever it wants. additionally they have a chance to flank. i really dont understand this situation.

    • Do you see any heavy tanks around nowadays? No? There is your answer, because it is historical. MBT >>>>>>>>> HT

      • ok, did u ever imagine a BC25t fighting with IS7 in real life? BC is circling an ıs7? ıs7 shooting and making only track damage? or an 17cm bullet is bouncing on 13-90 or just detracking a t71?
        type 59 also is a mbt but it has only 181 mm pen?

        yes you got a point but you cant explain this with “heavies sux so noone using them anymore”

        • T9/10 meds ingame are somewhat the breaking point to MBTs in real life. Armor doesnt matter that much anymore, mobility matters much more. Couple that with vastly improved ammunition performance on “smaller” caliber guns (100mm/105mm) and you get nearly only drawbacks for HTs.

          To your RL argument: Show me a tank with HP in real life :D

          Its a game after all and T10 meds need an edge over their t9 predecessors. They cant have even more mobility – otherwise LTs have no place anymore and other tanks would cry.
          They cant have even more DPM – otherwise TDs would lose their only advantage.
          They cant have even more armour – otherwise HTs would be completly useless.
          That leaves us with penetration – and that is somewhat historical, early MBTs got such good guns that armour doesnt mattered anymore in RL. And this killed the HT in RL – like T10 Meds kill T10 heavies in WoT.

          • Who cares about real life anyways? I think meds should not have more pen than tier 10 HTs even if they use apcr which has less normalization. As I said they need max 235-240mm equivalent AP pen which is around 250 apcr pen I guess. Now days not only do they have more pen that can punish heavys frontaly more effective than other heavys can punish eachother, they also have stupid 330mm of gold ammo making it idiotic. I even think 250-258mm AP pen is too much for tier 9-10 HTs because that means you can pen other heavys frontalty at crazy angles etc. Not to talk about TDs with 270-300mm AP pen that is idiotic as well.

            In WOT the tier 10 mediums may be MBT but that class doesnt exist in WOT, they are still mediums tanks and should be balanced accordingly. They have too much pen for beeing mediums tanks (specialy since even HTs have too much pen in some cases) and they have too much gold ammo pen. Good aiming should be rewarded not just autoaim, snapshot and load gold and pen and make damage and rely on RNG.

            • I think HTs should be restricted to the max speed of a Maus. Just to fuck them up.

  19. What? They’re replacing the Waffenträger auf. E100,my only tier 10,and nerfing view ranges of many TDs.There really is no justice in this world.

    • They didnt nerf view range on all TDs, for example they left it like it is on ferdinand 380 meters due to its bad camo rating. You must understand that some TDs that got nerfed in terms of view range did outspot even scouts due to having camo skill, net and even binos. Even if they nerf view range, using binos you will still get around 470-480m spotting range not to mention their better camo rating. They only nerfed view range for like 20 meters and that is not much to be fair, but it is a statement, a more psycological statements to discourage people from flooding TDs.

      • Yup,more reasons fore suicide scouting I see.If they really do want to make it balanced,the view range nerf is fine but the view range limit MUST be removed.Stupidest mechanic in the game.